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Host fucked with my v6 we're fine now


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How would the NAP deal with noise complaints?
Replies: >>638
>>637 (OP) 
I approve this soyjak because it's making fun of commies.
Not going to effort post a response because the op has a soyjak so the whole thread will probably get deleted by some retarded crybaby zzz mod.

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This has been bugging me for a while. I'm probably not going to say anything new, but I think a thread discussing the matter here would be nice. If we want to have perfect ethics, why should we apply the NAP only to humans? Why would one justify aggression against other animals? But in fact, why just animals? Why not also apply it to every other living being? Perhaps to non-living things as well: maybe it's atoms that have the property right, or maybe it's subatomic particles that do.
Also, all this poses a big problem. If it's true that it's not justified to violate their property right (if they have it), this makes it impossible for us to do anything without violating ethics, since merely developing the land or even just existing causes the death of some other beings or things, and it would make us aggressors by default.
This might all sound quite extreme, but I wanted to push the argument to the absolute limit.
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>>350
veganism (not necessarily vegetarianism) also has this problem to deal with... by plowing the field, a vegan is basically denying the existence of some smaller animals like bugs (ignoring other non-animal living beings as well). How to solve this contradiction?
Replies: >>617
>>350
>I don't see why being able to argue or reason is relevant to determine rights.
It's the only secular explanation for why humans are special. Even the smartest gorillas that can be trained to use sign language are still utterly incapable of asking questions or engaging in any other kind of abstract thought.
>>360
The reason for these frameworks, however primitive they were for the times they were in, established in trial after bloody trial what the correct and "best for you" way to live was along with the rationale for why it is so, Christ being necessary after all.

What I'd given you there was some of that rationale. You will know whether that rationale is valid or not, independent of one's theology for that matter, if you test it against alternate ideas and alternate theories or rationale and see which ones function as they are supposed to.

With mine and in what I gave you, it logically follows. Whereas the "animals should have personhood status ~ they are equivalent/have as much rights as man" argument made by modern law or modern lefty liberals will not logically and consistently "follow" when a lion mauls their offspring and their response is not "I'm glad that lions have the right to be lions".
>>360
Also props to the Blood Brothers - Papa Roach
>>361
It is true that smaller animals and other living beings die during crop production, but by far the vast majority of crop is fed to livestock. Only a smaller portion is directed towards human consumption. So, almost paradoxically, being on a vegan / plant-based diet leads to way fewer deaths of not only bugs, mice, and other small animals, but also plants as well.

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Can we talk about this?

https://archive.is/BFGt0
https://archive.is/secrz
https://archive.is/7AoSL
https://web.archive.org/web/20240227225551/https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/assange-indiscriminately-named-sources-and-encouraged-hacking-us-lawyers-tell-court/ar-BB1iF2gJ
Replies: >>577 >>602
>>575 (OP) 
This guy's been fighting the good fight against the U.S. for more than a decade now.  I don't know what else to say other than, "It sucks."
>>575 (OP) 
Good OP.

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Looking for recs
Replies: >>598
>>589 (OP) 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleolibertarianism
>Notable proponents and organizations
>Murray Rothbard, American anarcho-capitalist and Austrian economist.
>Lew Rockwell, associate of Rothbard, advocate of secession, and founder of the Mises Institute.
>Hans-Hermann Hoppe, German economist, anarcho- capitalist, and cultural conservative.
>Stefan Molyneux
>Javier Milei, President of Argentina
>Mises Institute, founded by Rockwell to advance Paleolibertarian and Austrian economic views.
>Mises Caucus, faction within the American Libertarian Party
These are all people I follow anyway. What other kind of libertarianism is there?
Replies: >>601
>>598
There's Cato libertarians aka Gary Johnson/Koch people

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>Argentina
>Things get worse and worse and worse every year.
>Hyperinflation, massive unemployment, government completely corrupt.
>Argentines vote for a libertarian only because they're so sick of the current system.  Even with the current political party spending nearly 2% of GDP on advertising for the mainstream parties campaign.  Thing have just gotten that bad.
>Meanwhile in Public Education Land...
>Covid remote schooling antics have turned out kids with incredible poor metrics.
>Basic reading, writing, and arithmetic skills are absolutely appalling.
>Kids spend their time talking about gender and sexuality.
>Home schooling, fuck now even UNschoolers are performing better.
>Parents keep their kids in public schools.
How bad do things have to get?
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I kind of this the point about how hard homeschoolers have been WINNING recently really needs to be emphasized.  It's one of libertarianism's greatest wins in COVID fiasco, and I think it's going to become more and more apparent in the years to come.
The thing about libertarianism is that it makes things worse right away, but then creates a trend where everything gets better and better.

Socialism does the opposite, everything improves, but then a trend is established where everything just gets worse and worse.
Replies: >>541
>>530
Most of the time, probably, particularly with monetary policy.  But things like cutting red tape or tax cuts most of the time just immediately make things better.
>>498
>What data do you want?
I want you to have some kind of argument that is not just "it's true because I want it to be true". Just because we're on the same side doesn't mean we should have zero standards with each other.
Replies: >>584
>>545
I don't know about hard stats but The Case Against Education is a good book for exploring the general ideas.

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Dear new people entering the board.  Let's discuss basic economics.

#1 - Price Inflation is caused by printing loads of money.  Not because of "corporate greed."  Nearly every money supply metric showed an enormous increase in 2020, and its taken time for that absolutely insane monetary inflation to hit the rest of the economy.
#2 - Even if one country can produce everything more effectively (they have an "absolute advantage"), they still have an economic incentive to trade due to the opportunity costs in producing one product over another.  This concept is known as "comparative advantage."  This is why criticism against "dumping" doesn't make sense.

Thank you for your attention.
Replies: >>549
>>542 (OP) 
Wrong. Everybody knows that price Inflation is caused by global warming and comparative advantage is white supremacy.

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books
Replies: >>9
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>>8 (OP) 
Replies: >>177
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bump because I keep coming back to this
>>9
I hate this long lists of books that the poster obviously hasn't read. Nobody needs to read 20 books on austrian economics.

If you're looking for one good book for each category
Economics: Bob Murphy's Choice
AnCap/Libertarianism: Roathbard's Ethics of Liberty
Anti-Statism: Hoppe's Democracy the God that Failed
Anti-War: Scott Horton's Enough Already

For fiction, Larry Niven's non-mainstream stuff tends to be very libertarian, Anansi and Red Tide for example. And F. Paul Wilson is a full ancap author you might not have heard of. If you really like Ayn Rand's stuff and wish there was more than Stephan Molyneux has some Randian inspired fiction.
Who /Palelolibertarian/ here?

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If you had to rank the following
>Hayek
>Mises
>Friedman
>Hoppe
>Rothbard
>Bastiat
>any unmentioned
Where would you place them?
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>>411
Could someone explain to me what everything in this post minus the last question is in response to?  Is there someone else/a different thread this poster is replying to that I don't have context to?  Everything except the last sentence reads like a complete non-sequitar.
Replies: >>416
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>>412
>who is he quoting / referencing?
No idea.

>>411
>If you say that democracy has so much wrong with it, then what do you propose instead?
If you want democracy you need to weigh the votes against how much stake the voters have in the property being voted on. For example look at how companies handle big decisions. Shareholds get a number of votes determined by how much they have actually invested in the company. There's no way they would let 1000 africans walk into the board room and starting voting on shit. This is not your property, your vote is meaningless, get the fuck out.

Hoppe talks about this in What Must Be Done. One way to handle the transition from statism to anarchism is to spin off all public services as private companies but then give citizens voting shares based on how much tax they have paid in their lifetime. That also solves the immigration problem because new arrivals who have paid zero tax and purchased zero shares get no voting rights.
Replies: >>427
>>411
>If you say that democracy has so much wrong with it, then what do you propose instead?
This is a thread for tier ranking different libertarians, not tier ranking different forms of government.  Although, that would be a cool idea for a thread.
>>416
>then give citizens voting shares based on how much tax they have paid in their lifetime.
Tax cucks > agorist chads.
>>411
I'm not fascist either but even I can see democracy is rule by mob.

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Why is the U.S. Democratic party so pro-corporatist in practice when they're able to claim that they're anti-corporatist in all their messaging?

I'mma go down the list ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_the_Democratic_Party_(United_States) ):
>Democrats support a more progressive tax structure to provide more services and reduce economic inequality by making sure that the wealthiest Americans pay the highest tax rate.
Immediately jump to increasing income tax rates in their messaging, and in practice never touch the corporate tax rate or god forbid capital gains, which is about the most pro-corporatist tax policy you could think of.  Even when they talk about eliminating tax loopholes, it's always "for the rich," not for corpos.
>They oppose cutting social services, such as Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid
>Democrats call for "affordable and quality health care" and favor moving toward universal health care in a variety of forms to address rising healthcare costs.
The biggest cost for corporations are pensions and healthcare benefits.  It's the largest corporate subsidy in the world.
>Minimum wage
This is the only one I can think of that isn't blatantly pro-corporatist.  But I believe the Democratic party just has this for looks.  I mean, it's always way under inflation growth, it's always "$15/hr" and not "lock it in with inflation," and from what I can see this is completely all bark and no bite because they never follow through on it.
>They also support universal preschool and expanding access to primary education 
To make sure corporations have less of their labor force concerned with childcare.
>They call for slashes in student loan debt and support reforms to force down tuition fees.
Gigantic subsidies for major financial institutions.
>Environment
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>>281
>"excessive centralization" can't happen without governments
Yes.

Lenin «The Impending Catastrophe and How to Combat It»

Compulsory syndication, i.e., compulsory association, of the industrialists, for example, is already being practised in Germany. Nor is there anything new in it. Here, too, through the fault of the Socialist-Revolutionaries and Mensheviks, we see the utter stagnation of republican Russia, whom these none-too-respectable parties "entertain" by dancing a quadrille with the Cadets, or with the Bublikovs, or with Tereshchenko and Kerensky.

Compulsory syndication is, on the one hand, a means whereby the state, as it were, expedites capitalist development, which everywhere leads to the organisation of the class struggle and to a growth in the number, variety and importance of unions. On the other hand, compulsory "unionisation" is an indispensable precondition for any kind of effective control and for all economy of national labour.

The German law, for instance, binds the leather manufacturers of a given locality or of the whole country to form an association, on the board of which there is a representative of the state for the purpose of control. A law of this kind does not directly, i.e., in itself, affect property relations in any way; it does not deprive any owner of a single kopek and does not predetermine whether the
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>>376
Projection.
Rules post features: Murray Rothbard with text saying "get in we're privatizing everything"
Core libertarian literature is authored almost exclusively by jews.
This entire board is dedicated to judeophiles acting as golem.

>>374
OP uses rhetorical questioning to lead posters to draw similar conclusions on ideological opponents so that he can ask a question which reinforces his intellectual superiority:
>How the fuck do socialists not see this?

Libertarianism is a distraction to occupy autists that aren't entranced by hormones and flesh shapers.
Replies: >>381 >>383 >>384
>>380
>first pic
god fucking damn it
>>380
>Core libertarian literature is authored almost exclusively by jews.
Hoppe, Hayek, Ron Paul, SEK3, Bob Murphy, Tom Woods, Lew Rockwell....

>The Free Market will solve this
As long as government has exclusive control over money we don't have anything approaching a free market.

>OP uses rhetorical questioning which reinforces his intellectual superiority
OP asked a serious question and got serious answers (until you came along). It's obvious that you are the one who is obsessed with "intellectual superiority" and you're projecting that onto everyone else.
>>380
>Libertarianism is a distraction to occupy autists that aren't entranced by hormones and flesh shapers.
I don't know about others but understanding real economics and personal responsibility has made me far richer than the kids I went to school with. Individualism is also a nice escape from dumb partisan bullshit since I can just agree with leftists on things I agree with them on and agree with rightists on things I agree when them on. There's no pressure to be an obnoxious faggot who ignores facts and logic and just throws shit at people because they're not "your" group.

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There's an anecdote that Walter Block told that happened in the aftermath of hurricane Katrina in New Orleans.  There was a huge shortage of ice, and a man was in a van selling ice out of the back at very high prices.  People were in a long line for the ice, and due to the high price, one of the people who was waiting to buy the ice, called the police on him for price gouging.  The police came, arrested the man, took his van and ice, and according to the story the people waiting in line cheered.  It's a clear cut case of the ultimatum game in reality, where people are willing for both sides to have _nothing_.

The remote chance of a possibility of this happening fed me with a sense of despair that libertarianism would ever be possible politically.  Particularly because the rejection of the ultimatum justifies price controls, welfare redistribution, protectionism, and nearly every government program.  Rejection of the ultimatum game, and its corresponding inequity aversion, forms an ethical basis that serves as the justification for so many government programs.

Ever since, I've been thinking about the ultimatum game quite a bit recently, and I think it suggests why, biologically speaking, people are not libertarians.  Therefore, biologically speaking, libertarianism is impossible to achieve, even though libertarianism may be ethically superior.  My big jump of an assumption in this argument is that the degree to which you are always willing to accept the deal in a single,
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>>349
Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit, I see.

>>354
I came to a place where lolberts congregate and explained the facts of life to you.  tl;dr  Wise up.  The Non-Aggression Principle is not viable in a society run by spiteful childless women who stay up into the wee hours of the morning, flicking the bean to fantasies of leading a platoon of Red Guards to your door.  They say so.  They can't shut up about it.  They've been saying the quiet part out loud more and more the past decade.  They feel safe doing so because in Western nations almost all the levers of power are already in their pudgy little hands.  Quoting Gallatin or Gandhi to the goon squad when they kick down the door isn't going to end the way you think it will.  Picking up a gun to make a solitary deracinated individualist last stand is unlikely to be better.

Lolbertarians like to do the Ghost Dance for Muh Constitution.  The Constitution is deader than the Treaty of Casco and didn't last much longer.  You'd better think hard about what even the normies are starting to see coming.   Refusing to decide is still making a choice.
Replies: >>357 >>358 >>363
>>349
Also, >>356
>Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit, I see.
When you say shit like that, you also make the entire movement look dumb when others read that comment.  There are a lot of other dismissive one-liners I would suggest to use next time.  E.g., "This reads like something out of Timecube."

Anyways,
>>356
You're bringing up a lot of stuff people wouldn't even have the background to understand what you're talking about unless they lurked on manosphere blogs for hours a day.
>spiteless childless women flicking the bean
>Quoting Gallatin to the goon squad
>"Deracinated"
>Unironically using the word "muh," "lolbert," or "normies."
Arguing points aside, and on a completely personal level, I think you need help.  You can go ahead and take this as an ad hominem I guess, but I'm serious.  When I read your post I feel like I'm reading a schizophrenic like Timecube or a serial killer in the making.  The reason I say this is because your vocabulary is so far outside of the norm that it's disturbing, and indicates a high degree of being terminally online.  Nobody speaks like this or uses these terms outsi
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Replies: >>358
>>357
But anon, even if it's cringe the extent of your argument is that of "I don't like your tone" or "wrong thread here".

>>356
You say the gulags are coming for the wrongful thoughts, but it's really just the poorhouse that's coming for the materially poor serfs. Put it in these terms; the dollar you earned will be worth 90¢ by the end of the year, 80¢ by the end of next year and so on, until the system of "make GDP go up by hiring more government employees" stops working. The pink haired hamplanets don't need to be dragged out to be hanged or beheaded. They are eating themselves out of their own houses. They grow so fat they die. I don't really know why you think even one libertarian bullet is going to need to be fired off before the problem eats it's own children.

Now the manosphere problems, those I think are caused by *too much* liberty. Particularly for women. Since women have been afforded all these legal and state protections, and since men are in particularly desperate positions, good men have found themselves simping for women to get some of what they want. For these same women, who admit that the ideal situation for them is to have both a "good" marriage and a "bad" marriage (misuse of the term "marriage" there is by their own inner workings). Once you give women this power, strong men will use violence to take it and form monopolo
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Replies: >>359
>>358
This isn't "wrong tone," this is on the level of "you're practically speaking gibberish."  He's like a Pentecostal speaking in tones or a schizophrenic homeless vagrant on the street yelling obscenities into someone's face.  Like I said, most people here haven't lurked on manosphere blogs 24/7 and don't even have the vocabulary to understand what he's saying, including myself.  It's not "Speak normal because I don't like your tone" it's "Speak normal SO WE UNDERSTAND YOU."

Also, "wrong thread here" is completely legitimate.
>>356
>I came to a place where lolberts congregate and explained the facts of life to you.  
If you want us to listen to you then you need to listen to us first. You have no idea what we're about you are just fighting a made up enemy inside your own head.

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