/christian/ - christian

>>26947 (OP) 
I think the Scripture makes it rather clear when it is read within its context. What were the Israelites doing at the time of these passages? They were turning to the pagan idols, the fallen angels, or they were attempting to create a false god in which to worship. Scripture is not against images or art because we know what was described within the Holy of Holies and upon the Ark of Covenant. The issue is the inversion of worship. Whereas God creates man in His image, the pagans create their gods in man's image. They carve up and make an idol in which they think that their god will reside as if trapped and answer their bidding, not unlike the tales of the genie in the bottle. The God of the Israelites was the complete opposite. He chose where His dwelling place would be and would not attempt to be contained, and much wrath would come if one did so. An example is the capture of the Ark and the misery that followed it from city to city.

Worship as patterned upon Heaven is always given to God alone. Veneration is simply a deep respect or reverence for holy things. Mary, as seen through Catholic and Orthodox lenses, is the Theotokos, the Mother of God. Something even Luther had no problem with. We give a great amount of veneration to her because she is the new Ark of the Covenant, the new Eve. The only groups of Christians who do not believe in the veneration of holy persons or objects are Protestants. All apostolic Churches venerate the saints and the Theotokos. So, it is more or less the default position. The link below is rather long but very in-depth on the veneration of Mary from an Orthodox perspective. I hope it is helpful for you. This topic, while it seems simple to answer, depends upon certain theological biases, such as one's view of Church History, tradition, Scripture, etc. How you view those will ultimately form how you view the answer given. God Bless! 

http://orthodoxinfo.com/general/veneration_mary.aspx

>>26947 (OP) 
Being far more carnally specific then the above poster. Look at the catholic's leaders head peices/hats. Notice how it looks like a fish with its mouth open. Now go read Judges 16:23, 1 Samuel 5:1-7, and the wikipedia page on dagon. Now go look at pictures of the vatican. Ask yourself why there is so many images of random things unrelated to the Bible in the vatican and start looking into the meaning behind the images. Now go a step further and look at every depiction of Jesus ever and compare it to Revelation 1:12-18

Let me surmise it simply; maybe at one point the universalists were actually a sect of Christianity, maybe they weren't. But nowadays their leaders are clearly dagon worshippers with imagery of babylonian talmudic origin mixed in. Also its a terrible idea to seperate Christians from another by labels e.g 1 Corinthians 3:1-5
>AND I, brethern, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
>I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither now are ye able.
>For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
>For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
>Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?
1 Corinthians 1:12-13
>Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ
>Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye bapitized in the name of Paul?

Was the pope crucified for you? Were you bapitized in the name of some protestant? Flee this board. The moderators censor things they do not want to see involving Christ being Lord.

>Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ
Should be
>Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.

My spelling is absolutely terrible. the above should be 
>AND I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
>I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
>For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
>For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
>Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?