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it's fucking video games, baby


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READ THE RULES


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Step 0. Resource Acquisition
Go here to get Anki, a flash card program:
http://ankisrs.net/

Here are some suggested decks:
Core2k/6k: https://mega.nz/#!QIQywAAZ!g6wRM6KvDVmLxq7X5xLrvaw7HZGyYULUkT_YDtQdgfU
KanjiDamage: https://ankiweb.net/shared/info/748570187
Kana: https://ankiweb.net/shared/info/1632090287
Tae Kim's grammar: https://ankiweb.net/shared/info/242060646


Other Resources
RealKana: http://realkana.com/
(alternate version) https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/learn/kana.html
Click the column of characters you want to study and type the corresponding romaji into the box as they appear

Kana Invaders: https://learnjapanesepod.com/kana-invaders/
Space Invaders/Galaga style clone. Type the romaji to shoot the kana alien

KanjiVG: http://kanji.sljfaq.org/kanjivg.html
Simply plug the character in and instantly get a stroke order diagram

Forvo.com: http://ja.forvo.com/
Type in a word or phrase to hear a native speaker's pronunciation

Tae Kim's Guide to Japanese: http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/
Great introduction to Nipponese, you can start here to learn basic grammar and vocabulary

Imabi: https://www.imabi.net/
Similar to Tae Kim

KanjiDamage: http://www.kanjidamage.com/
Learn Kanji by using mnemonics and radicals

Mainichi browser extension: http://mainichi.me/
Learn a new vocabulary word every time you open a new tab

JapaneseClass: http://japaneseclass.jp/
Learn Nipponese by playing games (requires registration) 

DJT Guide: https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/

Jisho: https://jisho.org/
Japanese-English dictionary

[YOUTUBE VIDEOS]
JapanesePod101: https://www.youtube.com/user/japanesepod101/videos
Namasensei: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqJ5wU4FamA&list=PL9987A659670D60E0
JapaneseVideocast: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLX6kjDZDLD_dNyrkdvTRKVKIJRo4g7xFD

>Alright I've got everything set up, now what?

Fucking LEARN, you bitch. Learn the Kana first, then move on to grammar and vocabulary. I don't have all the fucking answers, I'm just the OP. Maybe you can ask for help in this thread, but who knows if you'll find any worthwhile feedback amidst the shitposting. Honestly you should be able to figure most shit out on your own.
first for armpit demons
Replies: >>176497
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>>176496
>ate my image
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Continuing from the last thread
Thanks to >>176461 for mentioning Duckstation, I dumped mednafen, 5x upscale combined with the lack of subpixel precision in PSX's renderer causes so much wobbling that it makes it painful to look at. With duckstation you can bump up the internal resolution and it also has some hacks to reduce wobblyness, it looks much better. (Actually, I'm using the legacy branch because I couldn't be arsed to get qt6 installed.)
Also started the game and pic related immediately.. Do I need to try and understand that auto scrolling text at the beginning? Somewhy if I pause duckstation, it exits fullscreen mode.
Also, will there be any problem if I name my character ななし?
Replies: >>176532
>>176508
>Do I need to try and understand that auto scrolling text at the beginning?
It's the backstory of the game so look it up in a youtube video you can pause or something if you need more time to read it.
>Also, will there be any problem if I name my character ななし?
I always use the default names. There are two other characters to name later.
Replies: >>176556
>>176532
>look it up in a youtube video you can pause
I can pause the emulator too, that's not the problem, it's more like how much extra time on a scale of 0 to infinity should I spend on understanding that text.
>There are two other characters to name later.
Shit, that's too complicated for my tiny brain. I guess I'll have to stay with the default ones.
Replies: >>176565
Legaia_Densetsu_(Manual)(Scan)(JP)(PlayStation)(PSX).pdf
(20.8MB)
>>176556
I also found the game manual on archive.org, I think it starts with the same text as the game... Except for some weird reason, it has furigana, unlike the game.
If I start to read this shit. I'll be reading it for about a month.
https://archive.org/details/LegaiaDensetsuManualScanJPPlayStationPSX/mode/2up
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How do you stop mixing up languages?
Replies: >>176909 >>177046
>>176907
Which languages are you mixing up? Chinese and Japanese?
Replies: >>176916
>>176909
English, Japanese, Hungarian and Serbian  all at the same time. to be fair my family mix Hungarian and Serbian to the point where sometimes I don't which word is from which language.
Replies: >>176917
>>176916
Well I mean, first look up the Latin alphabet, and then look at most japanese text and you'll pretty immediately see the difference. As for Hungarian and Serb; I have no fucking clue you'd know more than I would.
Replies: >>176918
>>176917
I meant for talking, how do I stop switching languages? Reading is fine. Just talking messes me up. Sometimes it takes forever switch, other times it's almost instantly
Replies: >>181284
>>176197
JLPT is piss easy, N3 is babby tier. If you can even remotely call yourself a dekiru you won't have any problems.
>>176494 (OP) 
To summarize:
> Start by learning the kana (both hiragana and katakana). Also, learn how to pronounce each kana.
Be sure to actually write the kana on paper and follow the correct store order (the individual kana (and later kanji) should be larger than latin letters). Also, wiring down the kana will speed up your learning. But be sure to also use online kana quiz (like the one at https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/learn/kana.html).
<https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Table_hiragana.svg
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Table_katakana.svg
> Get a textbook (Genki for native (or native tier) English speakers. Look up what's the best japanese textbook in your mother tongue).
You don't necessarily need more than 1 textbook but be sure to get one (it helps you to avoid/correct some beginner mistakes).
Going to a Japanese course might be good idea, too (as you get to asks questions and talk with people (good for learning how to speak Japanese).
> Anki.
> Tae Kim's grammar guide and Imabi


>>176907
Never ever use ((( rōmaji )))! It's only good for lyrics/karaoke or learning how to pronounce Japanese.
>You don't necessarily need more than 1 textbook but be sure to get one
You don't need any textbooks. I was fine without one. To avoid beginner's mistakes, look shit up and don't speak until you're fluent (implying you have any friends to speak Japanese with).
Japanese courses are obnoxiously slow, the Japanese program at the college I want to takes FOUR FUCKING YEARS to go through Genki 1 and 2.
You could easily get fluent in that amount of time if you did no Japanese study other than watch anime with no subtitles, even less if you actually tried and used Anki while reading LNs and such after picking up the basics.
Replies: >>177055 >>177056
>>177049
>You could easily get fluent in that amount of time if you did no Japanese study other than watch anime with no subtitles
Actual harmful advice. Do not listen to this absolute retard if you don't want to waste 4 years you could've spent actually learning the language.
>>177049
>Japanese courses are obnoxiously slow
Nah, I tried it, it was too fast, I could barely keep up. And I knew the kana beforehand, so I had a month of head start or so.
>even less if you actually tried and used Anki while reading LNs and such after picking up the basics
Been doing that for 8 years if not more (except the anime part, I can't understand them, not even with subtitles), see half of the last thread for results. Maybe I could pass N3 if I really tried.
Replies: >>177068 >>177133
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>>177055
>he went to college 
(lol)
Replies: >>177074 >>177075
>Japanese courses
lel
>>177056
You're retarded and your opinion doesn't count. I've been doing it very casually since 2 years with long breaks sometimes and I can read isekai light novels just fine. Just give up if you wanna keep shitting this thread with your whining too.
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>>177067
>>177068
>want to shit on other anon's head
>can't even get his insult right the first time
lel
Replies: >>177087
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>>177055
You would seriously be better off taking that money and vacationing to japan for like a year than EVER spending it lining some college owners pockets.
Replies: >>177075 >>177077
>>177065
I went to college.
>>177065
>>177073
I never argued for or even mentioned going to college once in my post, but nice show of contrarianism for the sake of feeling "smug and superior" instead of actually trying to help anon. You are nowhere near as smart as you think you are and, in a parallel universe you'd be aligned to the left instead of the right and virtue signaling about niggers on Twitter. Remember, anons, retards gonna retard no matter the place or group.
Replies: >>177084 >>177087
>>177073
Funny thing is, I was thinking about doing an MSc in nipland. But then they were like BSc that's shorter than 4 (or I don't remember how) many years are not BSc, so I just table-flipped and left it that way. I guess I didn't really want to do it. Japan is a nice country if you're a tourist, otherwise not so.
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>>177075
>but nice show of contrarianism for the sake of feeling "smug and superior" instead of actually trying to help anon
First of all, saying college is a waste of money isn't even contrarian at this point. Second, you provided zero help to the anon, just essentially said "don't do this" but provided no advice whatsoever.
>You are nowhere near as smart as you think you are and, in a parallel universe you'd be aligned to the left instead of the right and virtue signaling about niggers on Twitter. 
Oh okay, you're a dumb cunt who thinks opposing beliefs are just two sides of the same coin. How the fuck is opposing the societal belief that going into massive debt while giving your money to kikes for a slip of paper that doesn't even guarantee you a career in your chosen subject equivalent to sucking nigger cock on social media? It's not even a belief that's exclusive to the right.
>Remember, anons, retards gonna retard no matter the place or group
>
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>>177071
>I've seen you've made a typo, tough luck pal
>>177075
>nice show of contrarianism for the sake of feeling "smug and superior" instead of actually trying to help anon
The last thread is full of anons trying to help that faggot and he just keeps whining and bitching, and you're just a nigger trying to stir shit.
>muh left
>muh right
Absolute retard.
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>all this talk about not going to college
But what about if my desired career can only realistically come about from college? I don't think there's any other place where I can learn the finer points of astronautics, for example
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>>177097
Then you should stop being a raging homosexual.
>>177097
Depends on the career. A lot of IT and even cyber will let you in if you can talk the talk but but you may get filtered at HR without a degree.
>>177087
>The last thread is full of anons trying to help that faggot and he just keeps whining and bitching
If this is just whining and bitching, then fuck you
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>>176423
>>176508
>>176565

I even tried to play that legaia thing without looking up words. Well, there's that seru and fog and wall, all with similar looking kanji, but the fog is the bad guy, our hero will be become something tomorrow and he will be allowed to go outside, but then the fog somehow destroys the wall without breaking a sweat despite not being able to do that for 10 years... and that fog looks like a bird without legs and with their beaks they knock down people. Or something like that. Also fuckloads of useless(?) choices (where what you choose doesn't do anything other than changing the next 1-2 lines) tickling my autism.
Then I've re-read the description from the pdf with dictionary, and so the seru is some weird creatures created by the gods to help the humans, but than fog happened and the seru revolted against the humans, the few survivors escaped to remote places.
Dunno what will happen now, either I continue the game like this, and not understand 80% of the shit, or I go back to my old method, and finish the game in 3 years after painfully analyzing every sentence in the game.
Replies: >>177114 >>177116
>>177104
This is bitching and moaning
>>151521
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>>175809

At this point you're just the nipponese niggerpill
>It's all over I can't understand anything god helps us all
If you've been doing something for 8 years without results, you need to consider if the problem is not you and your inability to learn.
Replies: >>177124
>>177104
Who said you shouldn't look up words? We said you focus too much on adding everything to Anki since it cuts into your time practicing.
Replies: >>177124
>>177114
>This is bitching and moaning
I didn't say that there aren't posts that can be considered as bitching or moaning. I just wanted to say that they're not all bitching and moaning.
>If you've been doing something for 8 years without results
There are results. It just that they're barely visible.

>>177116
Here: >>167234 and >>167580
Replies: >>177157
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>>177055
I don't want to epeen but you asked for it faggot.
I passed N1 98th percentile after three years of self-study (muh immersion method). A good 80% of my input was raw anime with the rest in LNs and some Anki, no test-prep or textbooks.
>>177056
This might not apply to you because of your turbo-autism, but I only realized who I was responding to after I wrote all this. Below should apply to most people.
The difference in self-learning and courses is the rate of learning. They both start off slow, but with self-learning you eventually hit a point where you start to learn much faster (around the time you can start to understand basic dictionary entries in Japanese). Courses stay glacial the entire time, which I assume would feel nice at the beginning but when you're only starting to learn about i-adjectives an entire fucking year into your studies you'll always be a dekinai.
Also college courses tend to attract shallow weebs who just like popular flavor of the month anime and not much else. I live near a college and once attended an event they held where you get to "practice speaking Japanese", it was a bunch of flaming faggots with neon hair and painted fingernails who couldn't even conjugate into past-polite despite saying they were in third-year classes and a few exchange student Japs who really didn't want to be there.
>>177097
I feel like that's one of the only reasons to go to college. Good fucking luck becoming a physician for example without going to college.
Replies: >>177157 >>177162
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>>177124
Look. The impression I got from the last thread is that you're not really enjoying Japanese. You constantly put yourself down by calling yourself retarded and incapable. You made numerous suggestions that it's somehow specially impossible for you. You seemed to really struggle with having to look things up all the time so the natural solution is to stop doing what's making you hate reading. Same with your reading being limited by anki. You're going to need to be able to understand Japanese without a dictionary at some point and I didn't want to say this earlier to not discourage you any further but I'm quite astonished that you're nine years into this. That can't possibly be nine years of continuous daily study right? It just means you've done multiple attempts and your first was nine years ago right? Anyway, nobody can help someone who is sabotaging himself. I was really trying to encourage you and make suggestions but your constant self-defeatism has made me run out of fucks to give. Figure it out yourself.

>>177097
Go if
1. You actually like academic learning AND
2. You have a definite reason to that's not, "well everyone else goes so I will too" AND
3. It won't destroy you financially
Pretty much everyone in that conversation had terminal autism and zero reading comprehension anyway.

>>177133
>tend to attract shallow weebs who just like popular flavor of the month anime and not much else
This is precisely the reason I avoid any kind of anime or Japanese club. I wish you still got bullied for being a nerd. That was far better than being associated with post-current year ironic nerds. None of these people would be watching anime if they got beaten up for it.
Replies: >>177162
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>>177133
>I only realized who I was responding to after I wrote all this
Am I famous now?

>>177157
>It just means you've done multiple attempts and your first was nine years ago right?
I wish that was the case, but no.
(Ignore the first year, things were a bit hectic there, I had no fucking idea how does SRS work)
The Tae Kin anki deck is gone and seems to have been for a long while I had to go back to the earliest snapshot on the way back machine to even find the page but the download there isn't saved. Does anyone here have it?
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>>177552
was it one of these
Replies: >>177556
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>>177552
>>177555
I found those files in a Japanese Learner Anki Package folder I had from a few years ago when I first started learning Japanese but Visualizing Japanese Grammar.apkg gives me an error when I try to use it.
I don't even remember where I got the download of that from.
Replies: >>177560 >>177588
>>177552
Not going to test if working, but you could try the one of the ones listed here. 
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/library/benkyou.html
Replies: >>177561
>>177556
>I found those files in a Japanese Learner Anki Package folder I had from a few years ago when I first started learning
same but I'm pretty sure I had the tae kim rearranged deck, let me look on my external drive
>>177559
>Linking trannyshit
Replies: >>177588
>>177561
Please show me your epic and based alternative website that has as much content as that site and/or proofs that the owner is a fag and why that makes everything on that site unusable.
>>177556
>Visualizing Japanese Grammar
Is that the one where each card is a 30 minute video? I don't understand why that deck exists. Maybe you could watch it once but why you would make that into an Anki deck I have no clue.
>>177552
Did you look here?
https://ankiweb.net/shared/decks/japanese
>>176494 (OP) 
I want to learn enough nippon for a jap food safari
Replies: >>177989
>>177984
you don't need that, if you go to any tourist place they most likely have english in their menus, fuck learning japanese and fuck yellow fuck let's go together and act like typical yokel tourists, indulge in the pleasures of food and get our cocks milked at a maid cafe
Replies: >>177993 >>177998
>>177989
you convinced me. let's go to Oarai first, then Tokyo~
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>>177993
that's the spirit
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>>177989
Join the JAV tours as a performer
Julia Kyoka has a sweet ass
Replies: >>177999
>>177998
let's make it happen, 3 anons on an adventure we'll see places people here dream about and then we'll make them our slaves to translate shit for us because we didn't learn japanese
>>176494 (OP) 
Learning vocabulary is easy enough, especially with anki. Grammar resources are all autistic and all try to explain things in a completely different way, but eventually I manage to understand things when I compare all of them on the same topic. What I could really use are good classbooks, something to just grind it over and over to really consolidate stuff like conjugating verbs. If anyone here has a good one, even if it's just the name, that would be a huge help.
Replies: >>178072
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>>178043
>consolidate stuff like conjugating verbs
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>>178072
What's the appeal of Namasensei? Every video of his I've seen he's barely coherent, teaches very little and has no entertainment value. That's ten minutes of him repeating te form endings over and over. Why not make it an hour at that point?
Replies: >>178104 >>179605
>>178096
>Why not make it an hour at that point?
Just watch it over and over again. You bitch.
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とわ is a variation of とは, right?
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>>178972
nevermind I am dumb
>>178972
Post the Post the run one one
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>>179004
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>>179080
That's not the post the run one one
>>178096
That's a genuinely good way to remember て endings though
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>>179605
And just change it to た for past tense for u-verbs.
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>……お前は本当に某熱血先生が好きだな
I spent the last half hour trying to figure out what that 某熱血 is supposed to be, other than probably a name. No, it was never mentioned before. No wikipedia article, no dic.nicovideo article, nothing. There are some results about some shitty soystation 4 game, but this book was made before that. Apparently there were some tennis player and manga artist with that name, but I couldn't find more info about them other than they existed. What the fuck is this?
Replies: >>180562 >>180563
>>180561
Mr. Hot Blooded Teacher?
>>180561
某 (ぼう) is a prefix meaning "a certain" or "unspecified". So it's referring to "a certain hot blooded teacher" without mentioning his/her name.
Replies: >>180577
>>180563
So it's not a name? Great...
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Now that tegaki is working, it's time to show off your mousemanship and write something in Japanese.
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>>180633
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>>180638
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>>180649
Shit. I forgot the thingies on sugiru -> "
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>>180656
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>>180662
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I tried.
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>>180902
>italics
why sturgeon why
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>>180902
Anon you added an extra stroke to 香り
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>>181255
>>176918
Try to keep a distinct accent for each, helps me out sometimes.
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>>181255
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>I'm not doing again what I was told
Anyway, here is this guy, he wants me to buy some oil and go to 警備 (I mean provided it's a place name... or rather he wants me to do something with the oil and my defense?). I've checked every shop, nothing sells 油, I've been to every village/house I can go to, nothing was called 警備 (well, there's a cave I haven't explored yet, but it's filled with too strong monsters. But based on how many extra levels I got from the random encounters I got by wandering around for hours, I might be able to defeat them now).
Any idea what do I wrong? I talked with every NPC in the starting village, even the drunkards inside the inn, they either don't tell anything interesting or I'm too stupid. It's like the second step (the first step was finding this guy in 貴族の屋敷, just south of the starting village, but a friendly NPC told me that) of the first quest of the game, so it shouldn't be that complicated.
>>181394
Isn't 売 the kanji for sell?
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>>181399
>Isn't 売 the kanji for sell?
Okay, I'm retarded. Still, doesn't change anything, I don't have any item like that.
Okay, fuck this game, there's a room in this mansion with 5 doors, behind one door there is a room from where you can go to a second room, but it was locked before. I have no idea when did it unlock, but going there triggered some event and it looks like the game advanced. Spoiler alert, it had nothing to do with any kind of oil or selling or defense (other than you were attacked in the end). I still have no idea how I was supposed to figure this out.
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>>181404
What game is it?
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>>181405
黒の剣 -Blade of The Darkness- (PSX version)
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>>181394
油を売る is an idiom for slack off and waste time. 警備 would just be like guard duty; he's telling you to make your rounds. (Mouse writing is not my forte.)
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>>181394
>he wants me to buy some oil
Replies: >>181455 >>181469
>>181411
I guess I'll have to go back to looking up every fucking word I see. Or more exactly, copy every sentence into jisho because it might have some unknown expression where you don't even realize that there is something you don't know.
>>181454
Fuck you too.
>>181411
That's kind of comedic if you think about it. Imagine some nip telling anon to cut it out and he comes back an hour later with a bottle of oil.
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>>181454
>Commie
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>>181469
I have subtitles turned off anyway so the only thing that matters to me is video quality.
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I have some noob questions:

1. Did you guys do anything else in the beginning other than going through anki decks for the first couple of 1k-2k words? My learning only consists of doing my daily reps in anki right now, and maybe looking up a grammar point or two and that's basically it. I feel like I should be doing more but I have no idea what I can do since my knowledge is still rudimentary. I tried reading through some doujinshi that I liked using an OCR program, but I'm still unable to really understand the sentences, even with a dictionary tool like Yomichan.
2. After you finished your 1k-2k whatever words, what did you do? Did you start reading doujins/manga? Did you start watching anime? And if so, did you start with beginner material, or just whatever you liked.
Thanks in advanced.
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>>181491
This is just what I did so there's no guarantee it'll work the same for you, but I studied the basic grammar first alongside the most basic of nouns and verbs (i.e. いる、来る、人). 
I really recommend that reading things and learning grammar take priority over anki, or to take things you see from reading and make your own anki deck(s) from them since pre-made ones can be kind of unreliable or lead you astray from my experience. 
Later down the line you can start using a japanese dictionary to look things up so you get a clearer understanding of them.
Lastly, don't be one of the fags here who has to look up 3 words and then has a mental breakdown and starts sperging about how hard learning japanese is. You're gonna have to do it a lot so just get used to it.
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>>181491
>Did you guys do anything else in the beginning other than going through anki decks for the first couple of 1k-2k words?
Yeah I used the book Remembering the Kanji and learned all the jouyou kanji.

>And if so, did you start with beginner material, or just whatever you liked.
There is no "beginner material", just start with what you like.
Replies: >>181535
>>181462
Well, I'd have done that, if I found any oil.
>>181491
I don't think I'm the right person to answer your questions.
>>181498
>don't be one of the fags here who has to look up 3 words and then has a mental breakdown and starts sperging about how hard learning japanese is
Is that me? Anyway, don't expect to read anything without stopping every 2 seconds to look up words in the first 1-2-5-10-... years.
>>181394
Better question is how the fuck that first particle somehow counts as a を
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>>181491
From the outset I was learning grammar, vocabulary and kanji. Made my own Anki decks for vocabulary and kanji, initially inputting words from the resources I was using at the time. I used kanjidamage for a while for kanji because I liked the idea of the by radical approach. That ordering and the example vocabulary is all I ever really took from it, however, ignoring all his mnemonics and such. There's some errors and misinformation in there; probably better resources with a similar approach out there, I'm sure. Early on for grammar I tried out Genki, Tae Kim, Japanese the Manga Way, Dictionary of Basic Japanese Grammar and probably a couple others. Tae Kim and the DoBJG sat best with me, Genki just felt like slow torture. Definitely recommend shopping around to see what you like best for grammar. Started properly trying to read later than I should have. Not long after I did get started I began just looking kanji up in Japanese resources with the aid of Rikaichan to get a sense of their meaning on my own. Initially I was reading a lot of easier doujinshi and manga. At some point I got kind of burned out and mostly abandoned any proper study and Anki card creation (still kept up on the reps) and just started playing (mostly doujin) porno games while looking up some words here and there in a Japanese dictionary. Maybe a year and a half and a few hundred eroge later and I could read a lot of things pretty well without a dictionary. Started watching youtube videos and anime and slowly my listening got better too. Speaking isn't really my forte, but I didn't learn the language for the purpose of communicating with others.
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Seems like the answers everyone gave me summed up was essentially just do more immersion no matter what level I'm at, so I guess that's what I need to do. I need to stop getting intimidated so easily.
>>181498
Alright thank you once again for this, I think I'll start doing it this way.
>Lastly, don't be one of the fags here who has to look up 3 words and then has a mental breakdown and starts sperging about how hard learning japanese is. You're gonna have to do it a lot so just get used to it.
Complaining is unproductive and I hate to shit up threads with bullcrap so I guarantee I won't.
>>181500
 >Yeah I used the book Remembering the Kanji and learned all the jouyou kanji.
Interesting...did you feel as if it supplemented your studies? Some guides swear by the vocab only route.
>There is no "beginner material", just start with what you like.
I see, thanks for the heads up.
>>181515
Thanks for sharing your experience it was very insightful. Right now, I'm just using Tae Kim and Sakubi as grammar guides, with the occasional internet search if I want to know more about a certain grammar convention in detail.  Think I'm going to stick with that for now until I can read Japanese dictionaries.
>>181535
>Interesting...did you feel as if it supplemented your studies?
Yeah, especially with learning how to differentiate similar kanji.
>>181535
Also here is a good video about language learning in general that has some good pointers for beginners.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWuGZidj76U
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>>181514
Dunno, but the を looks like that everywhere in the game. This is a screenshot from Vita's PS emulator, so there could be some inaccuracies there.
>>181515
>a few hundred eroge later
I read like 2-3 a year. I'm not gonna live long enough for that, shit. Can I continue learning nip in hell?
>>181535
>There is no "beginner material"
I wouldn't say that, some episodic slice of life story is going to be much easier than some detective novel with multiple interwoven arcs and riddles where you have to remember exactly what happened two books ago. Also slang/弁 heavy shit  can easily throw off beginners (or at least it did to me still does).
There's a difficulty rating in the djtguide for some works, I have no idea how accurate it is: https://djtguide.neocities.org/reading%20list.html
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>>181491
This is my second, and by far more successful, try at learning Japanese. I was a latecomer to it having only started learning the first time in 2018 and the second time only this year. The day you decide to do something is the day you regret not doing it sooner and that was certainly true for me. I was, of course, not starting from complete scratch. Years of watching anime meant I knew a bit of vocab, kanji and some of the basic particles and grammar. I also already knew how to write the kana. Another way of looking at it is that everything I learned in the years up to that point could probably be learned in a week of moderate study. So it was helpful but not that helpful. This is what I did...

My first attempt was towards the end of 2018. I downloaded the Japanese Learner Anki Package, read the readme and set up my stuff. I used the reversible kanji (recognition + production) deck and the core 2/6/10k vocab deck that came with the package. With the kanji deck, the first time I looked at the answer cards I was overwhelmed. Why is there so much crap on it? How are you supposed to remember all of that for each card? In particular the multitudes of readings each kanji has. There was just no way I would be able to remember these random readings for every kanji so I decided to only give the first keyword for each. I didn't realise at the time that this is all you were supposed to do. I thought I was doing it wrong. I just left the anki settings for the decks on the defaults so that was 30 new cards a day or 40 if you count the reverse of the kanji cards. I kind of read some of Japanese the Manga Way but got bored. After a short while (less than a month), I downloaded Yotsuba and started reading. I had to look up most words. Worse, Yotsuba doesn't speak in kanji and I didn't know where one word ended and another began. I was entering combinations of kana into jisho until it spat out a word. This was exactly as grueling as it sounds. Eventually I kind of got a sense for which kana tend to end words but I was still looking up pretty much all the words. My grammar was also shit. I knew the basic present and past forms and their negatives and that was it.

After three months, I remember I had something like 850 kanji in anki so I would have had something like 1700 words as well. I was on volume two or three of Yotsuba. This is where I gave up. Mainly it was because of the ballooning anki reviews. I was spending over an hour a day. Furthermore, I didn't think I was really learning very much in those reviews. Yeah, I could give the keyword for hundreds of kanji but I had no idea what words with those kanji meant or how to pronounce them. Kanji words usually have meanings that you would never guess in a million years from just knowing the kanji themselves. So it was pointless. I was also starting to forget a lot of kanji and words because I was learning them as arbitrary question:answer pairs rather than really understanding them. I was also still struggling through Yotsuba with only a dim awareness of what was going on.

I spent a lot of time after giving up thinking about what went wrong. I cam up with a list of things I would do differently if I ever happened to try again.
>Learning a kanji by just learning its keyword is pointless
It would have been better to learn the meanings of words that share a common kanji together and thereby gain an intuitive understanding of their meanings. In a sense, doing the reverse of kanji recognition study.
>I didn't know how to read kanji
I thought this was because of my own inadequacy and laziness at the time. But like the first point, it would have been better to learn words that share a kanji together so that you get a sense of how the kanji are read.
>I was learning the kanji in isolation making them hard to remember
I did use mnemonics for the difficult ones (as your brain is apt to do automatically). I recognised the radicals (as anyone who has to look up kanji on jisho does) but the fact is that, even with all the memory tools available, remembering a large collection of independent facts is difficult. Instead, I thought it would be better to learn them in context. To be able to say, "I recognise that kanji. It's the kanji from such and such word."
>A lot of kanji have similar meanings and I was writing the wrong one in the production cards.
Prime example: 屋 vs 室. I needed a way to distinguish between kanji with similar keywords.
>I was getting overloaded on anki and this was making me not want to do any reading
I had too many new reviews per day. Next time I would lower the number.

Fast forward to around March-ish of 2022. I had an internet outage and I didn't feel like playing any games. I stumbled across my old Japanese folder and opened up Yotsuba. It was just as brutally painful but somehow I could still remember a surprising amount of stuff. I had a kind of an instinct for what many kanji meant. I wasn't planning to restart learning Japanese, I just needed something to kill time. The thing is I went back to read more the next day. And the day after that. After a couple of weeks of this, I thought, "Fuck it. Let's do this." This time I was going to put my plan into action. First thing I did was look for an anki deck that grouped vocab by kanji and I found one based off a textbook called Kanji in Context. This goes through the kanji and introduces words that cover the common uses of each kanji and makes sure to cover all the readings. The textbook has an explanation justifying the order of kanji they use which includes consideration for frequency. Unfortunately, the deck and textbook do this thing where they introduce one word per reading for all the kanji and then go back through a second time to fill out the vocab. This was fixable by suspending everything and unsuspending the cards one grade at a time (the kanji are divided into seven grades). This new deck, I was sure, would solve most of the problems I had had the first time. One downside of this deck though is that it only does kanji based vocab. You need to already know hiragana words. The textbook says it's for an intermediate learner but I certainly wasn't when I started. Nevertheless, because I had made a previous attempt and so recognised many kanji already, that helped a lot. Another nice thing about the textbook is that it's completely in Japanese apart from the introduction. I don't use the textbook though because I hate doing exercises and reading those isolated sentences textbooks have.

I also picked up a 教育 ordered kanji deck for production only and suspended the recognition cards. In the kanji deck, I deleted all the useless crap cluttering the cards and added one important new field. A Japanese word field. The question side has the English keyword and then one or more Japanese words written in hiragana that I chose myself because I know the kanji in question is from those words. The answer side has the kanji only. The point of this was to remember the kanji as "that's the kanji from that word." For example, I remember 屋 as the kanji from 部屋 and 屋上 and also as a suffix as in 花屋. This also helps me remember some readings. The important thing is that I tried to pick a word that I already knew because that would help me remember which kanji I'm supposed to be writing and also it helped me recall the general shape of the kanji (because I know the general shape of the word) which makes filling in the details easier. Finally, I lowered the number of new cards per day to ten vocab and five kanji production. I also changed the order cards are presented so I could do reviews first and hold off on new cards if the number of reviews per day was getting too large.

Regarding grammar. Grammar was my favourite part about learning French at school but in Japanese not so much. I get too bored by grammar guides to even skim through them so most of my grammar has come from looking it up when I come across it in reading. Mostly what is considered grammar in Japanese isn't even grammar. It's vocab. Take ばっかり for instance. It's a word yet it's classified as grammar. I don't like Tae Kim. His book is laid out as if you wanted to know how to express a concept in Japanese. That is, it's made for production rather than input. It's not laid out well if you want to look something up. The best book for that I've found are the three Dictionaries of Japanese Grammar. Two bad things about them: 1) The Basic volume has fucking romaji sentences. All three have the English translations right next to the Japanese which sucks if you're a beginner and can't switch between the two. You get locked into English-brain. 2) It's in English alphabetical order rather than gojuon kana order.

The difference between my new method and my old method was like night and day. I was able to easily remember the meanings and readings of kanji by inferring them from the vocab I was presented with because that vocab was presented in a systematic order. Today I have over 90% success rate on mature cards. As an added bonus, I can often picture the right kanji when I'm listening to Japanese which has given me a boost in that area too. I can do this because I know the readings for the kanji and then it's just guessing from the context. I focused far more on reading than on anki this time. About volume six of Yotsuba was when it clicked for me. I still had to look up a lot of words but the structure of Japanese sentences started to make sense. From that point on, I really read. My anki for both decks takes under half an hour each day. On the other hand, there was a period of two or three months earlier this year where I was reading easily five to ten hours per day. I started reading other manga and VNs. I was able to read a whole manga chapter in one sitting. Then multiple chapters. Then a whole tankoubon volume in one day. More importantly, I could understand the plot with a dictionary. I started to practice not using a dictionary by having no-dictionary stories. A few months ago, I stopped using a dictionary almost entirely. My comprehension took a hit of course but it's since been on the rise again and I can generally understand what's going on most of the time.

Some general precepts to take from my story.
>Have a long hard think about which parts of your methods aren't working and why that is
This was really the key to getting to where I am today. I was able to identify what wasn't working and come up with solutions.
>Input is paramount
I didn't start to really comprehend Japanese until I made reading the number one priority. You can't get good at X without practising X. Are you trying to learn how to comprehend Japanese or are you training to give the right answer to an anki prompt? Make sure your study method reflects what you are actually trying to do. If you want to comprehend Japanese, you must practise comprehending Japanese. This is the ONLY way. I once read some batshit insane woman's language blog where she tried to claim that you don't learn to drive by going out driving and, therefore, classroom study is more important than input. Don't be like her. Another point to consider is that input is fun while anki is not. The times I have let anki start to take over are the times I started to not want to do any Japanese. The times I started the day with input are the times I felt motivated even to do my anki reviews.
>Isolated kanji recognition
It seems difficult to make a hard statement against this when so many people have had success by doing dedicated kanji study. These people are wrong. I would say that there are a number of reasons why isolated kanji recognition is not a good idea. Some of them I've hinted at above. I have learned more about kanji by not studying them than I ever did studying them. This does not apply to kanji production which I think you should do isolated. And you should do it. You can't say you know Japanese until you can do all four language skills and it only takes me five to ten minutes per day. Less if you're only doing reviews and no new cards. It's a trifling amount of time spent and the payoff is large. Especially since doing production study helps you recognise the kanji as well and tell similar kanji apart.

If you want to follow what I did, a note of caution. What I have done worked because I had made a previous attempt and had a (weak as it was) foundation to work off. Grab the list of grade 1 kanji (there are 80 of them) and try to give a word for each one from memory. Do the same thing for grades 2 and 3. If you can give a word for most of the grade 1 kanji and maybe half of the grades 2-3 kanji, then go ahead. Since I already knew basic words like これ and みんな etc, it was really just the kanji based vocab that I needed to focus on. If you're a total beginner, you'll need to do the core 2k deck instead. Because of the method I use, I am very weak at onomatopoeia and rarer hiragana words. Regardless of the exact method you use, as long as your method is input-centric, it is absolutely possible to get to the point where you stop using a dictionary in under a year. You could probably do it faster than I did. Also I neglected listening for too long. Don't do that. It'll kill your motivation to start because you're going back to "I don't know what the fuck is going on" territory. The most important thing is to keep your morale up by reading stuff that you find interesting.

Specific answers to your questions.
1) The hardest part of Japanese is not the kanji or vocab or complex grammar. It's the basic structure of Japanese and the underlying structure of thinking. This shit is as alien as it gets. And there is no resource for learning it. No matter what you do, your first manga is going to be horrible. You just have to power through and eventually it will click for you. You can't skimp on this process; it takes time.
2) I read nearly from the beginning. On my second attempt, I was reading again even before I took up anki again. I read Yotsuba first because that's what everyone says to do. I'd recommend it. It has some problems as a first manga but I think they're overblown and there are many more good points about it than bad. I also read Hanahira because it's given as a beginner VN. This one was a mistake. It's boring as shit. I did learn lots from it and, at some point during, I started being able to instantly comprehend a lot of the voiced dialogue so it wasn't all bad. It was also one of my no-dictionary things so that made it harder. Pick a voiced VN that's actually interesting though. Other than that, I just read whatever. Pick something with furigana to begin with. It makes looking up words much easier if your scan is high enough resolution that you can actually read them. At the moment I have several things running at once. Some of them are much easier than others.
Replies: >>181844 >>181944
>>181548
Thanks for the video anon. Will watch after making this post.
>>181567
>There's a difficulty rating in the djtguide for some works, I have no idea how accurate it is: https://djtguide.neocities.org/reading%20list.html
Didn't even know this existed. Thanks dude. There's also this too if anyone would like to check it out:
https://jpdb.io.
>>181587
Thank you for making this post, it is very detailed, I appreciate it a lot.
>I spent a lot of time after giving up thinking about what went wrong. I cam up with a list of things I would do differently if I ever happened to try again.
This is what I've should have done before. Break things down and figuring out what I did wrong before doing anything else. Also that list sounds a lot like all of the things I did wrong.
>anki deck that grouped vocab by kanji and I found one based off a textbook called Kanji in Context. 
Hmmm, need to check this out.
>I didn't start to really comprehend Japanese until I made reading the number one priority. You can't get good at X without practising X. Are you trying to learn how to comprehend Japanese or are you training to give the right answer to an anki prompt? 
Nice way to put it, unironically made me think.

Thanks anon, I'm going to save this post of yours. It's truly a golden gem.
Replies: >>181963
>>181587
There are a lot of people out there who use less than optimal or just plain bad methods, but if it leads to success for so many people then recognition study mustn't be inherently bad. Rather than recognition vs. production, your issues with kanji during your initial attempt all seem to stem from the fact you weren't associating them with vocabulary from what you say. The way I personally learn and review kanji, I don't have any of those issues. I don't learn kanji in isolation, but with the context of vocabulary that use them and I don't assign keywords to them. Nothing opposite here. The use of keywords aside, learning with vocabulary is how many advocate to do it. I've found my study greatly beneficial both in helping to recognize and differentiate between kanji. Similarly to you I can often picture kanji when listening to Japanese, even able to guess some unknown words in speech or catch verbal kanji puns on the fly. Even when it comes to writing, I can manage to write a couple hundred or so characters from memory even with virtually never having practiced doing so. All in all I'd do it all again more or less the same way if I had to. 

Studying kanji isolated from vocabulary is definitely something I can't get behind though. I've seen people liken it to being able to learn the language having come from a Chinese background because they have an easier time learning Japanese, but it just doesn't seem necessary. It seems like often these people even delay their start on Japanese as a whole to focus down the kanji alone. Even if they're "learning" like 50 characters a day, that's more than a month's setback. Then they have to maintain their memory of hundreds of characters long before they'll even know any vocabulary using them. I find it perplexing that there's some people out there that have never read a manga in Japanese, let alone a book but have some knowledge of more kanji than I do having been reading in the language for some years now.
Replies: >>181963
>>181844
Yeah sorry, I didn't mean to write my life's story. It came out a lot longer than I was expecting.
The KiC deck I use is this one https://ankiweb.net/shared/info/1996057559 Like most pre-made decks, you will need to tweak it a bit. Sometimes, you'll come across English meanings where you think, "Is that really what that means?" I keep a dictionary open when I'm learning new cards. It helps you more fully understand the vocabulary anyway. One thing you should do though is go into the deck browser and suspend every card. Then find all the cards marked KC1 and unsuspend. There will be two groups: one at the beginning and one starting at around 3500. This is because it's done in this silly way where they introduce one word per reading for all the kanji and then cycle back around to fill out the vocabulary. KC3 is very large so I'd recommend further splitting it down into subgrades. If you really wanted to try-hard it, you could rearrange the entire deck but this way should be fine.

>>181944
You're certainly right that the correct method is the method that actually produces results. That's why I said what I said. My way produced results for me and maybe there are people out there who struggle with similar problems.
>your issues with kanji during your initial attempt all seem to stem from the fact you weren't associating them with vocabulary from what you say
That's exactly right.
>I don't learn kanji in isolation, but with the context of vocabulary that use them and I don't assign keywords to them
I either didn't explain myself well or I'm misunderstanding you. This sounds like the same as what I do.

When I was speaking against isolated kanji recognition (if I missed out the word isolated anywhere in my last post, that was a mistake), I meant the kind where you see the kanji 書 and the answer you have to give is "write." You see a lot of people claim you can learn the kanji in three months doing this. In the fine print, of course, is only if you do 22 a day, it takes a lot of time per day and you still won't be able to read or understand any words. And that's still three months just to be introduced to the kanji. You don't remember kanji after only one day of exposure. Worse still are people who tell you do just do RTK for the first three months before you touch anything else. There are a number of reasons I think isolated kanji study is bad.
>1
Kanji aren't words. Learning kanji in this way doesn't help you understand words most of the time. Even when I know the kanji, I can guess the meaning of an unknown word in anki about half the time maybe. You have better odds if you're reading a story and have context to help you. Many Japanese words are simply unguessable from their kanji. Some kanji are a lot worse than others in this regard like 通 and 生 to name just two. If you don't already know what 生地 means, there's no way in hell you'll ever guess. Only when you look it up are you like, "Ah! I get it now."
>2
You are are associating a kanji with an English word instead of a Japanese one. A terrible idea - baking English into your understanding of Japanese at such a fundamental level. This is why I tried to stress that I wanted to be able to recognise that kanji as being from that particular Japanese word. Some English is unfortunately unavoidable during the learning process but there's no reason to use more than you need. This goes back to what I was saying about making sure your study reflects what you are trying to do. Are you learning kanji so you can associate kanji with meaning or are you learning kanji so you can understand what words with those kanji mean?
>3
Most of the time, it is done using English mnemonics as a memorisation tool. Pretty much the same problems as (2) but with the added problems that it slows down your recall and creates nonsensical associations of ideas. Mnemonics are powerful tools but use them sparingly and when you really need to. At least use a Japanese mnemonic.
>4
It doesn't actually help you read words either. Nobody recommends trying to learn the readings for kanji in isolation this way. That's because that's insane. Since you have to do vocab anyway, why not just incorporate your kanji learning into that by systematically grouping the vocab by kanji? By doing this, you also start to notice that, sometimes, the way a kanji is read is related to a particular meaning. Example - 生ビール, 生野菜, 生意気.
>5
Unlike with learning vocabulary, there's no way to "acquire" kanji as isolated things. That's because kanji don't appear in isolation, they appear in words. This is a lot more important than it sounds. When you learn a word using anki, you might learn an English translation but it's not until you encounter it in context that you truly learn it. The process goes something like this.
New words -------------(anki)----------------> Remembered words -----------------(input)------------> "Aqcuired" words
There's no analogue for the second half of this process for kanji and so you can only know kanji in an artificial way if you do isolated recognition study. It would be better to learn kanji through words than words through kanji. You learn them in a more natural way that way and you learn Japanese more on its own terms.

Again, again. In all of this, what is your goal? To "know about" Japanese in the same autistic way you "know about" whatever topic you happen to know a lot about? Or to understand/communicate in Japanese? Practise what you want to be good at. Whether you do kanji in isolation or not, make anki a small part of your total time.
>I find it perplexing that there's some people out there that have never read a manga in Japanese, let alone a book but have some knowledge of more kanji than I do having been reading in the language for some years now.
Precisely.
There are probably better ways of doing it that the way I mentioned above. Off the top of my head, you could be shown a kanji and then try to think of one or more Japanese words that contain that kanji. I've never tried doing that so I can't vouch for it. Maybe you could elaborate more on your method?
Replies: >>181966 >>182070
>>181963
>I meant the kind where you see the kanji 書 and the answer you have to give is "write."
No, you are specifically not supposed to do it that way. You are supposed to see the keyword and write the kanji from memory, not the other way around. The goal isn't to associate a kanji with a keyword, but to have each kanji and its writing committed to memory. The keyword is just a means to that end. 

These days I find it easier to use the Japanese reading of common words as a keyword. So if the kanji is 生 for example, I will use keywords such as nama and shou(gai) using parenthesis to signify extraneous parts of the keyword.
Replies: >>181993
>>181966
When producing a kanji I agree it's better to do it that way. Here's an example card from my kanji writing deck.

interval, space
じかん、 あいだ
----------------------
間

I picked those two words because I knew them beforehand meaning I can recognise them when written in kana. And also because those are the words I think of when I see 間. I'd like to get rid of the English but I don't know a word for every single kanji yet.
>No, you are specifically not supposed to do it that way.
It was my impression that some people advocate for exactly that. Now I just feel silly for writing all that out since I'm apparently arguing against no one.
Replies: >>182004
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>>181993
>It was my impression that some people advocate for exactly that.
Maybe some people who are doing it wrong do, but there is no reason to do so and the RTK book specifically tells you not to.
Replies: >>182007
>>182004
Are you trying to tell me I've been doing it wrong for the last 8 years?
Replies: >>182009
>>182007
For vocab you should learn both ways, just not for kanji.
Replies: >>182011
>>182009
But we're talking about kanji. There I only have kanji -> "meaning"/keyword/whatever you call it cards.
Also
>no need to write the kanji more than once
If I were to do it like that, there would be a 120% chance of forgetting everything two hours later.
Replies: >>182012
>>182011
>There I only have kanji -> "meaning"/keyword/whatever you call it cards.
In that case yeah you are doing it wrong.
Replies: >>182015
>>182012
But that doesn't make any sense. I don't want to convert random keywords into random kanji. What I want is when I see some kanji compound, recognize the word, where knowing what each kanji mean could help sometimes.
Plus in the other direction you have the problem with synonyms. When you have "machine", do you mean 機 or 械? Mix -> 交 or 混? Etc.
Replies: >>182050
>>182015
>knowing what each kanji mean could help sometimes
You already learn what they mean when you learn vocab. There is no need to drill an English meaning for each kanji when you are already learning vocab. That's just double the work to learn "the verb 書く means write" and "the kanji 書 means write"

>Plus in the other direction you have the problem with synonyms.
That's why you use a mnemonic in combination with the keyword to help you remember each one. Then once you get more vocab under your belt you can add Japanese readings in addition to the keyword to make sure you are recalling the correct kanji.
Replies: >>182074
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Best tools to edit manga/doujins or guides to make it look good?

I've been slacking off with reading material so i'm re playing Three Houses which has most of it's dialogue voiced, great material.

The happy portrait in pic cracks me up.
>>181963
>Off the top of my head, you could be shown a kanji and then try to think of one or more Japanese words that contain that kanji. I've never tried doing that so I can't vouch for it. Maybe you could elaborate more on your method?
In addition to an extra step or two, this is what I do actually. With my Anki cards, the front side is the character only. Now I'm sure I'm a bit atypical here, but on the back I have the readings, some stuff about the meaning of the kanji and which readings different meanings apply to for when they're distinct, and occasionally any miscellaneous stuff about characters that might be used interchangeably or whatever. The way that I review is I look at the character, think of a word or two (preferably a word for each common reading) that uses it, and write the character (looking at it as much as necessary) once or twice, often all while kind of vaguely conjuring an image of it's general meaning in my head. The review isn't really a clear-cut right or wrong answer, more or less just a way to quickly refresh my memory while asking myself, "am I familiar with this character?" If not I can spend a little extra time on it. As far as my initial learning process, I mostly just look up the word I encountered it in, then the character itself. Look through some of the example vocabulary provided for it's different meanings to get a better hold on how it's used. Then maybe make an Anki card. I usually prefer Goo for looking up kanji, though occasionally I use other sites too.
https://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/word/kanji/例/
>>182050
>You already learn what they mean when you learn vocab
Yeah, for some simpler kanji, sure. How am I supposed to figure out from 申し訳 that 訳 is translate? 称 is appellation, praise, while 称する is to call oneself or pretend. 汰 is luxury, but the only word in my anki deck that contains this letter is ご無沙汰.
Replies: >>182228
>>182074
>How am I supposed to figure out from 申し訳 that 訳 is translate?
You learn 訳す which means translate. And 訳 (わけ) which doesn't mean translate. 

>汰 is luxury, but the only word in my anki deck that contains this letter is ご無沙汰
How exactly is learning "汰 means luxury" going to help you figure out what ご無沙汰 means? 沙汰 is pretty much the only word you will ever see that contains 汰 anyway, it is not a kanji that shows up on its own.
Replies: >>182232
>>182228
I should have learnt Korean instead. Too bad they don't make anything noteworthy.
Replies: >>182296
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I'm at a bit of a loss here concerning the particles:
「じいちゃん以外の人間見たのもはじめてだ」
Before I get an answer, I just wanted to make note that the speaker speaks in a colloquial fashion all the time (they are a country bumpkin so to say).

Firstly, I'm confused about the meaning of the first の. From what it looks like, it doesn't indicate possession, and it isn't at the sentence end. So I'm a bit stumbled with this one.  Can anyone here give clarification of the meaning?
Secondly, のも is also giving me trouble. What does it mean in this instance? I know も can be used in conjunction with other particles, but I'm not sure it can with の. So are they together or are they seperate?
Thanks anons in advanced.
>>182232
Anon, it's a very bad idea to rely on singular kanji meanings. To compare, it's almost like learning English by spending your time on Greek and Latin roots, stems, and prefixes. Can be useful but it's not good to solely rely on. Learning individual words is the most important.
Don't give up anon, 頑張って!
Replies: >>182297
>>182295
>以外の人間見
People except [じいちゃん]. I'm not sure I can properly describe it, but don't get too attached to English meanings, の can mean more than physical possession.
>見たのも
の nominalizes the verb (turns it into a noun), so you have noun + も, which can mean something like too, even. It emphasizes that he never saw any person besides the old man. At least I think, it's a bit weird without context Also I'm stupid, so take everything I say with a tablespoon of salt

>>182296
>like learning English by spending your time on Greek and Latin roots, stems, and prefixes
But in English, you only deal with shit like that if you're into linguistics, while in Nip those fucking kanjis shove it down your throat the second you look at them. You could try to memorize them mindlessly, but I'm not sure that would be better. Yes, 汰 is probably an extreme, but most of the times kanji meaning and the words they're used in are not that random.
>Learning individual words is the most important.
Tried that, but I could never learn those fucking kanji. (Now, I'm not saying that now I'm good with kanji, I still have to look up words hundred times just to realize that I already know that word, just forgot the kanji...)
Replies: >>182343
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>>182295
Without context I'm gonna assume that the first の is nominalizing 
>じいちゃん以外
and the second is nominative for the verb and by extension the things before it.
Therefore it'd look something like
<except じいちゃん [this] is also my first time having seen a human
or more literally
<[as for] seen humans, other than じいちゃん, [this] is also my first [time]. 
It really helps to just intuitively understand the grammar since so much of it is untranslatable without losing some meaning in the process.
Like for instance saying 人間の alone can mean two different things in two different situations.
I'm not entirely confident in this answer though so take it with a grain of salt.
God I hope I'm right
Replies: >>182311 >>182343
>>182298
Why do I notice the washing machine first in the picture? And why do nip artists like to draw rooms so big that no mortal in that country possess?
Replies: >>182312
>>182311
>the washing machine
Hey don't talk about Akane like that.
>>182295
The meaning of の is a lot broader than what you've said. Aside from possession, it also indicates an "of" relationship but in reverse order. XのY = Y of X. It also can be used in an adjectival way so XのY = X-ish Y. In all cases, the thing before の is modifying what comes after. What kind of 人間 are we talking about? じいちゃん以外の人間. The second の is nominalising the preceding bit as everyone else says. の is probably the most important particle to get a good grasp of. I'm guessing that the speaker has just said something else was the first time doing something and this means "It's also the first time I've seen people other than jii-chan."
Replies: >>182343
>>182297
>>182298
>>182314
Thanks frens, your explanations really helped out a lot. I need to make note of what you guys wrote in your posts.
>Like for instance saying 人間の alone can mean two different things in two different situations.
>What kind of 人間 are we talking about? 
人間 in this context is referring to other human beings, or just people in generally. The speaker had never seen another human being until now.
Replies: >>182354
>>182343
>What kind of 人間 are we talking about?
You misunderstood what I was saying. It was a rhetorical question. The answer was じいちゃん以外の人間. I was trying to make the point that じいちゃん以外の says something about the people in question.
Replies: >>182547
>>182354
> It was a rhetorical question. 
I apologize for that one then, my mistake. Thanks again though, really appreciate it. I had to read up on that particle again for further clarification but your explanation basically summed up the most important parts.
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I was browsing Mobygames and came across this funny mistranslated Japanese line. I guess they didn't notice that comma
Replies: >>183060
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Help me a bit before I go buying oil again,
>しかしガンダムことかおるんは、気にした様子なく、少しはしゃいだ様子で続ける。
Apart from the gundam references which I obviously won't get since I haven't touched any of it, what the fuck is しゃいだ (or しゃい, but in that case why is that だ copula there). If it's シャイ, why isn't it written in katakana. Or maybe 謝意, but that should be in kanji, and the だ is still bugging me.

>>183059
Still better than what the modern tranny ((( localizers ))) do.
I also didn't notice the comma
Replies: >>183076
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>>183060
>what the fuck is しゃいだ
Not しゃいだ, はしゃいだ
Replies: >>183078
>>183076
Oh, so that は is not a particle. Fuck them, why can't they use spaces.
I feel like instead of progressing I'm only regressing...
Replies: >>183196
>>183078
You're hitting the first wall, just keep pushing it.
Replies: >>183233
>>183196
I wish.

Also, is there any practical difference between 格好いい, 格好良い and their possible readings of かっこういい, かっこいい, かっこうよい, かっこよい?
Replies: >>183464
>>183233
かっこいい is just like an abbreviated version of かっこういい basically, and it's the more common way to read it. いい is just a more colloquial よい and that doesn't change in this word. There are a number of words that have come to commonly either drop a sound and/or add a っ or something different from the standard reading for ease of pronunciation or occasionally maybe a misreading becoming more common than the proper reading. Two I can think of off the top of my head is 洗濯機 as せんたっき vs せんたくき and 雰囲気 as ふいんき vs ふんいき. But anyway it's just somewhat of a difference in impression here for the most part.
>>181491
Here's what worked for me.
I read a basic grammar guide without trying to memorize it (think Tae Kim, though surely something better exists by now).
Then I did a few premade Anki cards for extremely basic and common words.
After a few of those cards (don't remember how many but likely not more than a hundred) I jumped straight into watching raw anime.
When I came across a sentence that I could almost understand (usually meaning I knew all the words but not a grammar point, or all but one word, rare at first but it gets better) I would make my own card via subs2srs that had audio and an English definition. I just treated grammar the same as new words because outside of conjugation it usually is basically just a specialized word.
Do your reps or die, if you're doing more than an hour of Anki a day cut back on the new cards.
I would also take the audio from the anime and put it on a media player to listen to when I wasn't doing anything important. Autistic but I think it helped.
After maybe half a year of that I started trying to use definitions in Japanese on my cards when I could understand them as well. Switching to Japanese definitions is a process and takes a bit of mining definitions themselves but is worth it.
In the beginning almost all my reading was in Anki, but after a while I started trying to read basic manga like よつばと! and then regular manga like DEATH NOTE (lol).
After a while of that I found a light novel series that I liked and read the ebook version. My ebook reader had a built in dictionary function and saved highlighted sentences making it very easy to mine for sentences.
Then I just kept doing that until I had 10,000 or so total Anki cards, which took somewhere between 18 and 24 months total I think, not sure exactly how long. That sounds like a lot but it was under 19 new cards a day average. By then I would say I had basic fluency and could just remember most new words without having to SRS them (not perfectly but good enough).
Also I did isolated kanji memorization for a bit in the beginning but I'm not sure if it helped that much. Definitely don't waste your time trying to learn how to write them if you're not planning on living in Japan, the only thing that'll happen is that you'll instinctively draw a square the same way every time.
I didn't bother with pitch accent. I just wanted to understand and didn't care about sounding good since I'll always be a gaijin, and from what I can tell learning it only gets you a few minor pitch accent puns and tricking Japanese into thinking you're a native speaker when talking on the phone.
Also of note is that Jewtube is pretty good for Japanese audio as well if you get tired of anime.
Replies: >>184699
Why do nips like to put cover images on a work that has absolutely nothing in common with the actual contents? Manga anthologies are the worst offenders, but it happens in other cases too.
Jisho
>手を回す: to use one's influence; to pull strings; to take measures; to make the necessary preparations
But in my example sentences I see shit like this
<香澄さんの脇から手を回し、下から持ち上げるように胸をもむ。
<そんな結衣ちゃんの抵抗に逆らって、腰の後ろに手を回す。ぐっと彼女の身体にしがみつく。
<きゅっと、その身体に手を回すと、 じわりと柔かい熱が、胸にこみ上がる。
I guess this is not the meaning I'm looking for.
Replies: >>184582
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>>184562
Replies: >>184586
>>184582
But that's 回す not 手を回す.
Also
>12. to gang-rape
why
Replies: >>184589 >>184593
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>>184586
>But that's 回す not 手を回す.
Replies: >>184654
>>184586
>Why
Think about what 女の子を回す might mean.
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Why did he delete it? First I thought it was some stupid mod again

>>184589
I mean, if there's is 手を回す in the dictionary, isn't that supposed to be more specific than 手 + を + 回す?
Replies: >>184658 >>184661
>>184654
>I mean, if there's is 手を回す in the dictionary, isn't that supposed to be more specific than 手 + を + 回す?
No, it means 手を回す is an idiom. You are looking for the literal meaning.
>>184654
>I mean, if there's is 手を回す in the dictionary, isn't that supposed to be more specific than 手 + を + 回す?
No. Just because you can say "shoot the shit" doesn't mean you can't say it literally.
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Found this fun little browser game that tests your moonrune knowledge. It's called Ultimate Kanji Shooting. Fair warning: it's made in Unity, resource intensive, and it loads up ~100MB of data.
You have to type 20 words to win. Contents include all sorts of things: normal words, jukujikun, yojijukugo, place names, person names, weird kanji you saw a handful of times like 颪(おろし), etc. Definitely not for beginners.
https://unityroom.com/games/kanjishooting
>>183508
>Do your reps
What's your opinion on using something like the speed focus add-on to set a max time per card? (e.g. 3 seconds to show back, 9 more to pass)
Replies: >>184701 >>184826
>>184699
That seems unnecessary. I just use the hard button if it takes me a while.
Replies: >>184721
>>184701
I dunno. It helped me cut down on review time by 80%. Without it I'd spend 60~80s on each card. Also comes in handy when running on the treadmill.
>>176494 (OP) 
What are some of the most accurate literary translations? It doesn’t need to be manga, in fact it could be translated from English into Japanese.
>>184699
I never used that when learning Japanese but I did later for other topics. It's only really useful for me when I space out during reps and think of something else while staring at the screen, but that doesn't happen often.
Is it a good idea trying to translate shit?
>>185430
Assuming you have a good grasp of the language and want to translate things that matter to people like vidya, yes. Ignore elitist f/a/ggots, spiting the ironic weeb cabal that keep flooding translation/scanlation with their pubic discharge is as noble a goal as encouraging others to learn nip.
Replies: >>185462
>>185430
For the purpose of learning the language, it is not. As said, translation should come after you already have a good grasp on the language. It'll only serve to slow you down a fair bit while also keeping you in that English to Japanese mindset which you should be trying to work away from. Assuming it only takes the same amount of time to translate a line as it does to read it (often you'll spend longer) for every 1 book you translate, you could have read 2 books. It can amount to a huge difference in the amount of Japanese input you get over time, and that input is the best thing for you. Setting aside what's good for you as a learner, as an amateur in the language, you'll only be making more of those same shit translations which likely encouraged you to learn the language in the first place.
Replies: >>185462
>>185430
If you mean translation as in poems, songs, etc. then absolutely not.
If you mean translating something more straightforward, like a manga chapter, it'll be painstakingly inefficient. You'll spend a lot of time fussing and wrestling with the text to find a way to adequately convey what was written and make it fit in a speech bubble, especially when you come across an expression or idiom with no equivalent in the other language.
Moreover, expressing things in a foreign language is extra challenging because you have to phrase things naturally. I mean, some people don't give a shit as long as they get their point across, but given everyone shits on Pajeets and spics for their broken English, it only makes sense to learn properly.
Replies: >>185462
>>185434
>good grasp of the language
Um, there might be problems there.
>matter to people like vidya
I have no idea what matter to people, I usually only bother with obscure shit. But this means that they're usually untranslated.

>>185457
>>185461
I guess that's a no, then.
Replies: >>185473
>>185462
It can sometimes be good to write out all the meaning of nouns, adjectives etc. in a sentence in english if you don't understand them but translating them just for the sake of it will probably just hurt you. It will help you memorize stuff if you write the sentences (in japanese of course) down yourself though.
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It's afraid.
>>185542
If nobody cares then why did he even make the retarded tweet
Replies: >>185549
>>185546
You expect logic from a person who probably has "breathe in - exhale" played in an earphone, repeated infinitely, so he doesn't forget it?
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>>185473
I have shit like pic rel, not sure whether it's useful or not though.
Is the jouyou table a meme? Common runes found in common words like 掴む, 紐, 逸れる(はぐれる), 吠える, 詫びる, 孵化, 褪せる, 擽る, 瓦礫, 倦怠感, 癌, 痙攣, 攣る(つる), 流暢, etc. are not included on the list.
>>185542
>learning a language to experience new works is not a valid reason
It truly is a clown world that we live in.
Replies: >>185643
>>185639
>倦怠感
>攣る
>孵化
>褪せる
>擽る
>common
Half of those *words* aren't common, and many of the others aren't written in Kanji most of the time anyway.
Anyway, jouyou kind of is a meme. I would focus on learning words for their usefulness over a list that resulted from America's aborted attempt to delete Kanji from Japanese because nuking them twice wasn't enough.
Replies: >>185650
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>>185643
>Half of those *words* aren't common
I was under the impression that they were. For example, the fatigue one is a medical term and I saw it all the time during the plandemic when describing vaccine side effects. I found 孵化 in a (mostly) kana soup Digimon game for kids of all places, which left me under the impression that it was common, etc.
>Anyway, jouyou is kind of is a meme
Thanks for confirming.
Replies: >>185659
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>>185650
Maybe 孵化 aside, they're certainly not uncommon. I think I've only seen 孵化 like 4 or 5 times personally, and I think 2 or 3 of those it was written ふか or ふ化. When I was still actively making Anki cards I would add kanji I deemed useful enough to my deck when I encounter them and added around 100 non-jouyou kanji, but am missing a couple hundred jouyou kanji. When I look through the the list, I do recognize most of them, but there's got to be at least 50-100 jouyou which I don't think I've seen even once.
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Learning programming, math, and japanese at the same time is hard. I'm mentally fatigued.
>>185542
>twitter screenshot
This isn't cake/v/ nor is it 4um. Why do you even bother with idiots like this?
Replies: >>185662
>>185661
It's motivation. What better encouragement for learning Japanese is there than horrible people that specifically don't want you to learn it?
Replies: >>185696
>>185662
I see, in that case I'm rooting for you. People tend to get motivated by proving others wrong, so anything that pushes you toward your goal is a good thing.
Replies: >>185699
>>185696
I mean motivation for the other people here. I already learned Japanese.
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