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It's very likely that the average anon is a massive poorfag. Share some things that you learned or thought up when trying to save money even if it might seem a little extreme. Here's some things that I do or have planned on doing:

>Borrow special occasion outfits from your relatives instead of buying them.
>If someone you know dies, visit their family and ask if you can take the clothing of the person that just died (It's harder for them to say no if you ask them in person). Do this with your neighbors too if you are on good terms with them.
>Use leftover boiled water for drinking when it cools down. Alternatively, you can use leftover boiled water as a weedkiller since plant roots are sensitive to hot water.
>Go dumpster diving.
>Follow food recipes that were made during the Great Depression. Clara's Kitchen is a good starting point for finding them.
>When driving a car or riding a bike, try to intentionally run over small animals like rabbits for free meat. Hitting over larger ones like deer is fine too but you may end up damaging the vehicle.
>Don't shower if you aren't planning on going outside tomorrow.
>Use old clothing as towels and cleaning rags.
>Rub used-up drying sheets on your armpits instead of buying deodorant. 
Foraging and hunting are also other ways to save on money but I'm probably too incompetent for that.
>>73677 (OP) 
are you that guy that went dumpster diving and posted pics of the shit he found?
Replies: >>73679
>>73678
No, but he was what made me believe that the average anon is borderline homeless.
For dumpster diving 
>don't take stuff that's open 
>don't take stuff that should be refrigerated, meat is often left to thaw and then put back into a freezer in commercial settings, specially in grocery stores, if it's in the trash odds are it's not safe 
>do take canned food, it lasts eons and it should be safe even if the can is dented as long as it's still sealed 
>do take properly packaged food as long as it's properly sealed 
>expiration dates can be hit and miss, use your own discretion and don't be retarded
Replies: >>73681
>>73680
Also, 
>don't shit the place up like a hobo, if you do don't be surprised if you come back and find a lock on the dumpster
>>73677 (OP) 
>hunting
Hunting is retardedly expensive, especially if you don't already have a firearm and ammunition. It also presumes that you live in an area where guns are even legal in the first place.
>black market
Yeah good luck with that. If you somehow have the connections and the social ability to acquire a firearm illegally, what the fuck are you doing on a website like this?
>Foraging
Requires a lot of experience; buying a book to identify plants that corresponds to local flora in your area is a must. Don't rely on a smartphone, you faggot.
If you live in some barren desert where nothing grows, you're fucked.
>>73677 (OP) 
>try to donate plasma for money as a neet
>get deferred for 90 days due to being deferred too often 
Shit's fucked brah.
>>73688
>he's even able to donate plasma and get money for it in the first place
Replies: >>73701
>>73688
I thought you killed yourself. Shame you did not.
Replies: >>73701
>>73687
>Hunting is retardedly expensive
Nigger just run
Replies: >>73709
>>73691
I'm actually not able to. That was, you know, the point.

>>73692
dp
>>73677 (OP) 
>>Rub used-up drying sheets on your armpits instead of buying deodorant. 
That doesn't work at all, I knew someone who used to do that and he fuckin stank like dogshit when he started sweating, but with that weird dried flower smell mixed in so he just smelled like a rotting corpse. Of fucking course i was the only one who told him this, everyone else was too "polite" pussy to say anything that might hurt his feelings.
I take as many of those little free condiment packages from fast food restaurants as I possibly can and use those instead of buying bottles of ketchup or containers of salt. You can just walk into fast food joints and snatch some then walk out, nobody gives a shit if you bought any food or not.
Also if you work a job that requires traveling and they pay to put you up in hotels that's basically a completely free supply of toiletries and coffee since you can just request more every day that you're there provided you don't keep asking the same clerk. You may also get away with stealing a bath towel or two but personally I can get over the thought of possibly hundreds of people having rubbed their disgusting bodies with those so I always just bring my own out of hand.
If you're craving pizza you can also try walking into Papa John's or some other pizza chain restaurant at the end of their work day and ask if they have any no show or wrongly made pickup orders just laying around. I don't know about that for sure though, I just know when I worked there during high school we would keep the more commonly requested mistake pizzas (pepperoni, suasage mushrooms and pepperoni, etc.) on a heating rack and just send those out if another order with one of those came in. We'd always have some leftover at the end of the day though and my manager would just hand that shit out if someone walked in and asked as long as they didn't look homeless (because then the store would be flooded with nigger bums at closing hours.
It has been many years since I've worked in any pizza places though so corporate may have cracked down on that shit.
Oh yeah, get warranties on electronics and then break them right before the warranties expire for free replacements, sometimes you'll get an upgrade if the model you have isn't in production anymore. My brother used to do this with digital cameras, got away with it for like ten years too until he forgot to register one of them for the warranty and wound up stuck with his current one.
*
If you have the time make your own bread, its:
<tastier (you can add shit like dried tomatoes/nuts/seeds/etc)
<healthier (as you can leave out the sugar that's usually added in store bought ones)
<cheaper (depending on flour/your electricity bill)
Basic recipe that will work with cheapest flour is:
100% flour 400g
65% water 280g
2% salt 8g
Pinch of yeast 
You really don't need the amount of yeast that recipe usually suggests, it only impacts the time bread bulk ferments (rises).
And I recommend getting scales if you don't have them, or there will be much more guess work until you figure out what dough should look like.
I can't come up with good words on how to describe bread making process as there are so many details and nuances, that observing a video would be much better. 
You can make it as complicated as you want it, bread will likely be eatable. Just make sure to wait solid hour after getting bread from oven or pan to cool it down.
*
>Buy seasonal products (the ones with cosmetic damage are obviously cheaper)
>Preserve it (canning/fermenting/drying/salt/etc)
>???
>Profit
>>73694
I'm no expert on hunting, but what about traps? Do you need loisense to set basic traps?
>>73709
>I'm no expert on hunting, but what about traps? Do you need loisense to set basic traps?
Legs.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persistence_hunting
>>73687
>Hunting is retardedly expensive
Dunno where you live but it's not expensive in the US with the exception of very specific states (the usual suspects) or those gay hunting resorts where yuppies pay thousands of dollars to do what rednecks do for the cost of shotgun shells. Outside of the initial investment of the shotgun/rifle and the camouflage you'll be wearing hunting is only limited by your ability to afford a box of shells and whether or not you have land/know someone who will let you hunt on their land. It's basically the go to activity for bumpkins because it's cheap as shit.
Also a slingshot + ball bearings easily kills most smaller game, and you can more easily get away with owning one of those even in cucked areas.
Replies: >>73769
>>73687
>Hunting is retardedly expensive
It CAN be but doesn't have to be. Probably the most expensive part would be transport if you are a city fucker and have to uber to an area you can hunt on. You also generally don't need tags for pest and prey animals such as coyotes, squirrels, rabbits, raccoons etc. Some states even pay out bounties for certain species like nutria in the south or wolves in Idaho.
>especially if you don't already have a firearm and ammunition
You can go to any half-decent gun shop and pick up a .22 rifle or 12ga shotgun for under $200 right now. 
>It also presumes that you live in an area where guns are even legal in the first place
Bows, crossbows, slings, spears, airguns and black powder guns exist and typically aren't regulated like firearms.

>>73709
>I'm no expert on hunting, but what about traps? Do you need loisense to set basic traps?
If you plan to trap on national lands or wildlife refuges then yes, I believe so, I think you need some certificate with wildlife service and probably written permission from the office overseeing the land. If you own your own land or get permission to trap on private land I don't think anyone cares though. Make sure to use live-catch traps (NOT foot-hold traps) if you are near places with outdoor pets so you don't accidentally injure them.
Replies: >>73805
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>>73677 (OP) 
>When driving a car or riding a bike, try to intentionally run over small animals like rabbits for free meat.
You eat roadkill? No wonder you're poor.

>Foraging and hunting are also other ways to save on money but I'm probably too incompetent for that.
Learning about your environment is fascinating. Take trips to the woods and find out what grows over the year.
Replies: >>73724 >>73769
>>73722
A buddy of mine used to pick up roadkill from wherever he found it then he'd take it home, skin it, clean it, and eat it.
Replies: >>73728
>>73677 (OP) 
Whenever you have spare money throw it at random shitcoins. You'll hit the jackpot one day if fortune smiles upon thee.
Replies: >>73765
>>73724
Rednecks are subhuman.
Replies: >>73752 >>73761
>>73728
And you're a vagina.
>>73728
Have you stopped shoving shit up your ass yet?
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>>73727
That's like saying throw money away on lottery/slots/gambling basically. There is nothing wrong if you do your research and invest money you can safely loose on memecoins, just don't expect it to be your way out of poverty.
>>73711
>Also a slingshot + ball bearings easily kills most smaller game, and you can more easily get away with owning one of those even in cucked areas.
Still need a hunting loicense.
>>73722
>walk around in woods
>find fuck all
>someone else walks in the same area as I did
>they come home with full baskets of mushrooms
sure do love foraging
<lol its ur fault
doesn't fucking matter, as soon as I actually try to forage for anything, theres fuck all to be found
Replies: >>73770
>>73769
A hunting license is like 20 dollars and no you don't typically need one for smaller game because who the fuck is going to rat you out for killing squirrels or rabbits? Almost no one buys those licenses, at least where I'm at. It's large game licenses that game wardens will try and get you with fines, but even then the chances of them catching you without one are borderline non-existent. There are thousands of hunters in the country and hundreds of thousands of acres of wilderness, they can't watch it all.
Replies: >>73776 >>73778
>>73770
how come plasma donors get money? I get spam calls for donating double red cell because I have +O blood. I'd donate blood for free but I can't handle the all the  spam calls in my voicemail that appear after I donate. I must have gave them my number somehow.
Replies: >>73777 >>73826
wrong reply
>>73776 meant for >>73688
>>73770
>A hunting license is like 20 dollars
They're many times more expensive than that.
>who the fuck is going to rat you out for killing squirrels or rabbits?
It's not considered normal behavior here, so anyone will rat you out.
You underestimate the cuckedness of cucked areas. Must be nice living in an area where common sense is king.
>>73778
>>73778
>They're many times more expensive than that.
a bow hunting license literately cost $15 and Iive in California
Replies: >>73805
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>>73778
You can fit a rabbit in a small sack, and if you use something other than a gun, nobody's gonna even hear anything.  You'd pretty much have to prance around all the way through town with a shotgun screaming "I'M HUNTING WABBITS!" for anyone to even notice.
Replies: >>73805
>>73688
your blood is fucked, get the message
Replies: >>73855
>>73778
>they're many times more expensive than that
just looked it up for the exact amount and its $23 where i am and i live in one of the more expensive states you are talking out of your ass about something you already admitted you dont know much about that or you live in some other country in which case none of this would apply to you at all anyway
Replies: >>73786
>>73785
>>73778
also ive lived in a city and killed rats and pigeons right in front of people before because theyre pests and no one gave a shit youre just looking for excuses
if you dont want to hunt thats fine theres no need to be retarded about it
Replies: >>73805 >>73838
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>>73717
>crossbows
You need a firearms loicense to use crossbows past a certain draw weight.
>spears
Ooga booga. Don't you think people will notice me walking around with a spear?
People are everywere, even in the countryside. And they're always looking.
>black powder guns
I'll never be able to pry a black powder gun off a collectors hands.
>>73780
>bow hunting
Tried archery in a range, missed 28/30 shots from a 25 metre distance, with a "hit" being defined as "getting arrow within the rings on the archery target".
One arrow hit the person on my lefts target instead.
>>73781
Image related.
>>73786
>no one gave a shit
Just because they didn't react in a manner in which you noticed their reaction doesn't mean that they didn't give a shit.
>no one gave a shit youre just looking for excuses
Ah yes, good old blame shifting.
>if you dont want to hunt thats fine
Of course i want to. It's that I can't, and the reasons are all stupid.
>>73776
You can donate plasma once or twice a week but blood you cannot donate. If you did try to live that way, as an income, you'd die. They used to give you money for blood but that did not end well.
>>73805
>Don't you think people will notice me walking around with a spear?
Call them racist if they stare and threaten to call the cops for cultural discrimination.
>>73805
No you dont hence you finding retarded excuses or outright making shit up to justify your inaction in this regard.
>blame shifting
i dont even know what this is directed at who was blaming people for anything? youre a crab in a bucket. go away crab.
Replies: >>73838
>>73829
>retarded excuses
Reality is stranger than fiction.
>outright making shit up
I really wish I was.
>who was blaming people for anything?
in >>73786 :
>youre just looking for excuses
Ergo: "it's your fault".
>crab in a bucket
I'm not pulling anyone else down. If you can do it, go for it. I can't and I'll make sure to explain why.
Replies: >>73858 >>73878
>>73805
If you are uncomfortable with using spears you could go with even more primitive methods and just chuck rocks to catch animals. My cousin and I used to hunt rabbits by throwing rocks and basketballs at them. We never caught one but we were close.
Replies: >>73840
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>>73839
Try using a net (with weights on the edges).
>>73784
Not how it works.
>>73838
what hellish pozzed 'n cucked country are you even from dude? Maybe you should move to africa or something.
Replies: >>73928 >>73937
get a job nigger
Replies: >>73868
>>73859
>blast off to jobland negro!
>>73709
Bread is pretty easy to make, this anon is right about it being healther and tasting better
You will find if your kneading by hand you need to add more flour, and it might fuck up your dough if you add too much. I could very well be retarded though
Replies: >>73880
>>73838
if you live in the US you are just looking for excuses, if you don't live in the US then refer to the part you apparently ignored where i said "none of this would apply to you"
Replies: >>73928
>>73677 (OP) 
>Stab people in the alleyways, they may not have a lot of money, but they won't be missed
>don't pay taxes, it's a scam, instead file all your tax forms as a shipping container registered to one of the chinese shipping barges. The shipping company will have to pay YOU tax for every international boarding
>Dry toilet paper and re-use it, greatest life hack chris-chan taught me from his prison days
>A well un-known fact is that ducks in the park are free and are NOT, in fact, endangered. Grab a duck, wring its neck and bam, you've got at least a week worth of meat, broth and stock to live off of
>If you have a basement, save up for a semi decent camera and abduct children into your sex dungeon. Take photos (make sure to get their feet into the fram) and send those pics to Nickelodeon or public Hollywood execs
>If you find a piece of moldy food, do not throw it away: that's free penicilin. Repackage and sell it to paranoid moms as a "Sweet Sweet Covid-19 repellent"
>Stalk young people in the bushes and then steal their used condoms, go to the sperm donation clinic and sell their jizz there. Music festivals are a goldmine of spunk.
>Go to the public library and steal their books, read them, then hold them for ransom. New books aren't printed anymore and each book is basically an NFT at this point, you might even make tens of dollars.
>Some people are willing to give you monetary rewards for goods and services you provide to them, try some out, maybe learn a simple trade from the internet you obvously have access to
>Go up to cars stopped at red lights with a wet rag in one hand and a hammer in the other. Wipe the windscreen and people will be obligated to pay for your services. If they don't pay, break their windscreen. If you can't find a hammer, a solid brick or stone will do the trick.
>Instead of sitting outside and begging for change like a common pikey, write a cardboard sign offering psychological/psychiatric services to zoomers. People are so starved for societal validation, it won't even matter if you're good, just make a fetching sign.
>If you get stressed out yourself, just go on vacation. There is no need to drive or fly anywhere, it's all the same. Planes have been proven to have TV screens built in instead of windows. Any time a plane "crashes because of decompression", it's really the government blowing up the planes on the ground.
>Always hustle. Don't sleep, hustle. Eat only when you can't hustle. Don't buy or even steal water, hook up a plastic tube to your urethra and drink your own liquids while you hustle. Don't waste time and resources to clean youself, funk up your hustle. Turn every disadvantage into a hustling advantage. Any disability is a rank up on the progressive stack. Extremity necrosis is just melanin enrichment. #HUSTLE
Replies: >>73927 >>74197
>>73876
Kneding is easy, just have jar with water to dip hands in, and don't add flour.
If you can plan ahead you can greatly reduce the amount of time you kneed the dough.
https://iteroni.com/watch?v=tWIn8NHJkFU
>>73709
>canning
Wouldn't the equipment required be considerably more expensive than just buying canned good? 
You need to make it airtight but the material needs to have enough resistance to heat to not fuck up your food at the required temperatures. I wouldn't trust plastic for that unless you're already a femboy.
Replies: >>73921 >>74155
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>>73920
Nigga, what equipment.
Replies: >>73922 >>73951
>>73921
I may or may not have forgotten glass exists.
Replies: >>73951
>>73879
here's your (You)
>>73878
>>73858
Incompatible personality issues is a thing whether normalfaggots that like to flame x nation get it or not. If you've a bad personality you need to be born in basically a nice European nation to get on the welfare state or you are blatantly fucked.
Replies: >>73937 >>73939
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>>73709
>65% water 280g
don't do this anything lower than 70% hydration you'll need to start doing kneeding work because the dough gets sticky and won't be firm  enough to stay in place without it, I generally use 75-80% water, depending what I am making
>>73858
>what hellish pozzed 'n cucked country are you even from dude?
I'd rather not say, but it's a really, really bad place.
>Maybe you should move to africa
African countries immigration laws are hilariously strict. Liberia doesn't allow people that aren't atleast partially Negro to become citizens of Liberia.
>>73928
Here comes the "its all your fault" faggots.
Seems like people who have it atleast okay can't comprehend to what it's like to have a dealt hand so bad that nothing can be done with it, nor that choices aren't made in a vacuum.
>welfare state
They're all failing, thanks to the invading niggers that clog the welfare systems. You'll have a family of niggers roll in one niglet in a wheelchair claiming that it has a shit ton of disabilities, then they all nig it up with the huge amounts of money that get thrown on them.
Replies: >>73939
>>73928
What the fuck, we were talking about killing animals and eating them, not welfare state bullshit. Where is this coming from? Did you respond to the wrong posts? Did I respond to the wrong post?
>>73937
>>what hellish pozzed 'n cucked country are you even from dude?
>I'd rather not say, but it's a really, really bad place.
Well in that case the hunting stuff I was describing wouldn't apply to you. I'm talking strictly about how it is in the US, I have no idea how the hunting culture is in other countries. I wish I could help you there because it is pretty fun but if it's not affordable because of cuck government shit basically turning the activity into a rich socialite thing there's not much you can do about it besides start poaching.
>>73921
>>73922
That glass stuff is only for high acid fruits that you could have just dried out with some oven instead and or sunlight. It'd be lighter that way and not spoil if truly dried out. Even bananas people turn into chips you know as well as apples and such. Why even use glass jars when the beef jerky and dried fruits is a thing? Fuck the cans they're post modern and faggy. Things like pemmican exist for a reason. People even freeze dried fish for ages.
Replies: >>73954 >>73958
>>73951
Have you ever tasted a pickle, anon? Have you even seen snow?
Replies: >>73966 >>74006
>>73951
Because freeze dried stuff are dry, canned stuff can be juicy.
Replies: >>73966
>>73954
People in a real pickle don't travel by flagship, ergo they would bring dry food. 
>>73958
Surviving isn't about how juicy something is.
Replies: >>73968
>>73966
Eating dried food 24/7 isn't good for your body unless you're drinking enough water to make up for it, and that can be quite challenging depending on the situation.
Replies: >>73971
>>73968
>not owning water straws
>living away from rivers
Replies: >>74013
>>73954
vinegar is one of God's gifts to man
Replies: >>74023
>>73971
>eating nasty shit just because you don't like the container of the juicy stuff
Replies: >>74120
>>74006
pickling has been around for thousands of years across ancient Egypt, Mesopotamia and Roman period, hardly modern at all
>>74013
>liking 'canned' peaches/pears,etc, basically fruits, over jerky, hardtack, dried berries, and nuts.
Replies: >>74121 >>74266
>>74120
Yeah what are you going to do about it? Lay a banana out in the sun and dry it into chips after you shoved it in your ass?
Replies: >>74227
Learn handsewing and sew yourself a postman bag. Shit i learned from my first try is
>partitioning internal space is bullshit, sew seperate pocket at the outer side if you want pockets. One giant partition with pockets at outside is superior to anything else.
>the main cover should reach the bottom of the other half
>main cover should be water resistant, synthetic leather is king for this
>worn out fabric is better than brand new
>all pockets must be at the opposite of the cover side, you will always wear it with cover cover side at the opposite.
After you sew the bag, carry it everywhere with snacks, water, plastic bags and whatever you might need inside. I don't think i bought anything to eat/drink in the last year.

>>73920
If you boil jars and fill them right after you take them out of the boiling water it will be airtight. If you don't close them hard enough it will die out and you can see them swell easily. I did my own ketchup and tomato souce, i still eat them after about 2 years.

You can make your with milk and something that can be filled with milk. every country/culture has their own way and all of them taste better than the factory made garbage.

you don't need toothpaste, just brust it dry with a toothbrush and gargle vinegar once a week.

Have water in the toilet and wash your ass and dry it with TP. This is cheaper and cleaner than just wiping with TP

Learn linux, window managers, keynav and qutebrowser then sell your mouse, you won't need it.
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The government can't prove you're not super autistic = free money!
Any tips on dumpster diving?
Replies: >>74164
>>74162
yeah, read the thread
So many replies and, at least having skimmed through them, it appears that strangling ducks in public parks came up before anyone mentioned fishing. Never change /b/.
>>73879
>Instead of sitting outside and begging for change like a common pikey, write a cardboard sign offering psychological/psychiatric services to zoomers.
Have another (You). I'm seriously considering giving this one a go once the weather improves. I think if I set up near enough to the right uni with a sign offering schizo-analysis from a legit street schizo that trust fund hipsters who have fallen down the critical theory or continental philosophy rabbit hole would throw some of their trust fund money my way for a passing session. It's not so much that I need the money, but I imagine it would be an entertaining way to spend an afternoon when taking a break from being always online and schizo posting on IBs.
Replies: >>74198
>>74197
We are sikh, we don't eat fish.
Replies: >>74212 >>74215
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>>74198
lol wat a gay
>>74198
>We are sikh
Get some rest man, I hope you get better.
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>>74219
3rd pic got me wondering are there cannibals working in morgue, eating flesh nobody cares about.
Replies: >>74224 >>74367
>>74223
In west taiwan I guarantee the answer is yes. In africa they wouldn't even do it in secret.
I have an Orange tree what to do with all the fruits? Made some Orange jam  but I don't like the bitterness on my toast. Should I mix it with another fruit jelly or is it too late? I have store bought blueberry and strawberry jam in the fridge.
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>>74121
What I'm not going to do is give myself bad teeth and diabetes due to a southern fetishism towards high sugar foods, unlike yourself.
Replies: >>74228 >>74297
>>74227
>if you eat something you do it in amounts that result in negative health effects
You're going to stay a fat retard with a banana in his ass no matter how dry you make it afterwards.
Replies: >>74246
>>74225
make orange chicken stir fry yum yum
>>74228
>it's not about what you eat but how much
Are all southerners this retarded?
Replies: >>74256 >>74260
>>74225
Make kompot with those fruits if it isn't being used. Orange peels are also edible but they take a lot of effort to make them not taste like shit.
>>74246
bro youre eating the same shit its just dried out and people dont get beetus from eating bananas also jerky is probably one of the worst things you can make a regular diet of
Replies: >>74300
>>74246
Ever heard of food pyramid? They teach that stuff in primary school.
Replies: >>74297 >>74299
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>>74120
>jerky, hardtack, dried berries, and nuts.
CUT MY ASS INTO PIECES, THIS IS MY DIET'S RETORT
IMPACTED, NO SHITTING, DON'T GIVE A FUCK IF MY ASSHOLE BLEEDING
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>>74260
I'm pretty sure it's wrong.
>>74227
If you eat anything processed you will get hueg amount of fructose/sucrose, same with alcohol(besides the fact that it metabolizes in brain it's pretty much sugar for your body)/juice (store bought one)/soft drinks. 
Last ones also have hueg amounts of salt so you keep drinking it.
I sure hope you don't consume any of it, Dear murican.
>>74260
Yeah, and canned hardtack does NOT go at the bottom of it.
>>74256
Cheap glassed 'canned' shit is not the same as what dried foods would be.
Replies: >>74305
>>74300
And where did I say get store bought shit? You know you can do these things yourself and control what you consume right? Get some fluids in you that aren't semen your brain is shriveling from all that dry shit.
Replies: >>74380
>>74223
>morgue cannibal
It could make an interesting movie!
>>74305
>doesn't even get my joke
You can only 'can' with glass high acid fruits and nothing else. That's not a balanced diet. It's just some southern treat. Worried about nutrients? Ancients ate fucking dandelions, tree bark, acorns, etc. When it comes to preserving food most ancients didn't have, you know, fucking airtight glass. Yet I'm the cancerous modern human here? Even if they had something like bread or beans canned it's not something you'll find in some redneck's glass jar. No, just faggy fruit.  

Even if they had bread in some glass container it'd surely be fruitcake.
Replies: >>74384
>>74380
Your joke was gay and stupid, just like dried fruits.
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